NYSE:ALB Albemarle Q4 2022 Earnings Results & Report $92.85 -2.00 (-2.11%) As of 11:23 AM Eastern This is a fair market value price provided by Massive. Learn more. Albemarle beat analyst expectations on both earnings and revenue in its Q4 2022 results, released February 16, 2023. The company reported EPS of $8.62 versus the $8.46 consensus estimate, while revenue of $2.62 billion topped the $2.60 billion estimate by $22.02 million. Revenue increased 193.1% year over year. Research:ProfileEarnings HistoryForecast Earnings Announcement Details QuarterQ4 2022Report DateFebruary 16, 2023TimeAfter Market ClosesConference Call9:00 AM ET Albemarle EPS ResultsActual EPS$8.62Consensus EPS $8.46Beat/MissBeat by +$0.16One Year Ago EPS$1.01EPS Beat Rate7 of last 8 quartersAlbemarle Revenue ResultsActual Revenue$2.62 billionExpected Revenue$2.60 billionBeat/MissBeat by +$22.02 millionYoY Revenue Growth+193.10%Conference Call ResourcesConference Call AudioConference Call TranscriptSlide DeckPress Release (8-K)Annual Report (10-K)SEC FilingEarnings HistoryCompany ProfileSlide DeckFull Screen Slide DeckPowered by Albemarle Q4 2022 Earnings Call TranscriptProvided by QuartrFebruary 16, 2023ShareShareShare This ReportLink copied to clipboard.Key Takeaways Exceptional Q4 performance: Net sales nearly tripled year-over-year and adjusted EBITDA rose over 400%, driving a record diluted EPS of $9.60. Strong 2023 outlook: Albemarle forecasts 55%–75% net sales growth, 20%–45% adjusted EBITDA growth, and 10%–25% higher operating cash flow while remaining free cash flow positive. Margin normalization ahead: Energy Storage EBITDA margins are expected to decline from 65% in 2022 to about 46%–47% in 2023 due to spodumene inventory timing and joint-venture accounting impacts. Rising capital intensity: Planned CapEx climbs from $1.7–$1.9 billion in 2023 to $4.0–$4.4 billion by 2027 as Albemarle invests heavily in conversion capacity, advanced materials technology and resource development. Global expansion continues with North American and European lithium conversion projects in early development and ongoing environmental permitting work at the Kings Mountain site. AI Generated. May Contain Errors.Conference Call Audio Live Call not available Earnings Conference CallAlbemarle Q4 202200:00 / 00:00Speed:1x1.25x1.5x2xTranscript SectionsPresentationParticipantsPresentationSkip to Participants Moderator00:00:00Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Albemarle Corporation Q4 2022 Earnings Call. My name is Glenn, and I'll be the moderator for today's call. If you would like to ask a question during the presentation, you may do so by pressing star one on a touch tone keypad. I'll now hand you over to your host, Meredith Bandy, Vice President of Investor Relations and Sustainability. Meredith, please go ahead. Meredith BandyVP of Investor Relations and Sustainability at Albemarle00:00:25All right. Thank you, Glenn, and welcome everyone to Albemarle's 4th quarter and full year 2022 earnings conference call. Our earnings were released after the close of market yesterday, and you will find the press release and earnings presentation posted to our website under the investors section at albemarle.com. Joining me on the call today are Kent Masters, Chief Executive Officer, and Scott Tozier, Chief Financial Officer. Raphael Crawford, President of Ketjen, Netha Johnson, President of Specialties, and Eric Norris, President of Energy Storage, are also available for Q&A. I'll note that today's call will be limited to 30 minutes, shorter than our usual quarterly updates since we just held an in-depth update about 3 weeks ago. The replay of that webcast is available on our website. Meredith BandyVP of Investor Relations and Sustainability at Albemarle00:01:12As a reminder, some of the statements made during this call, including our outlook, guidance, expected company performance, and timing of the expansion projects, may constitute forward-looking statements. Please note the cautionary language about forward-looking statements contained in our press release and earnings presentation. That same language applies to this call. I'll also note that some of our comments today refer to non-GAAP financial measures. A reconciliation to GAAP financial measures can be found in our earnings release and the appendix of our earnings presentation. With that, I'll turn the call over to Kent. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:01:47Thanks, Meredith. Good morning, and thank you for joining us today. I'll start by highlighting that our fourth quarter results were exceptional, with close to triple the net sales from the same period in 2021 and adjusted EBITDA up more than 400% year-over-year. While rising lithium pricing contributed to these results, we also saw significant increased volume growth. Scott will go into the financial details for the quarter and the year. We are confident in our assessment of the market opportunity for our essential elements and equally confident of our ability to seize that opportunity. We anticipate net sales growth of 55%-75% for 2023. Our strategy is not just to maintain, but to build on our global leadership in both Energy Storage and Specialties, we continue to invest in both capacity and innovation to make that happen. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:02:48Now I'll turn over to Scott for the details. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:02:51Great. Thanks, Kent. Good morning, everyone. Let's start on slide 5 to quickly review the fourth quarter 2022 performance. Net sales for the fourth quarter closed at approximately $2.6 billion, up 193% from last year, driven primarily by our lithium segment, but we saw increases in bromine as well. Net income attributable to Albemarle was $1.1 billion for the fourth quarter. Diluted EPS for the fourth quarter was $9.60, which was a record for Albemarle. In fact, it easily beat our previous full year EPS record of $6.34 back in 2018. Turning to slide six. Fourth quarter adjusted EBITDA was over $1.2 billion, up almost five and a half times year-over-year. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:03:44This $1 billion increase was primarily driven by higher lithium prices and increased volumes. As you can see on the slide, these high quarterly results also contributed heavily to our full year increase in adjusted EBITDA of nearly 300%. Our bromine segment was up slightly. As expected, our catalyst segment came in lower in the quarter as higher sales volumes and favorable pricing were offset by a plant shutdown due to the winter freeze in Texas in December. Full year 2023 guidance is unchanged from our strategic update in January. We continue to expect strong sequential sales growth in 2023. Remember, we have assumed flat year-end 2022 lithium pricing throughout 2023. We expect our adjusted EBITDA to be approximately 20%-45% higher than 2022, with positive trends in all three businesses. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:04:50Additionally, we expect net cash from operations to rise between 10% and 25% over 2022. This means we expect to remain free cash flow positive this year, even after increasing our growth investments. On slide eight, we expect to see net sales increase sequentially quarter-to-quarter as our volumes ramp up. We project that our adjusted EBITDA will be evenly split between the first and second halves of the year. As a result, we anticipate that margin rates will moderate as we progress through the year, and I'll come back to that in a moment. All three of our business segments are looking at healthy growth rates during the year, reiterating what we detailed in our January event. Since our webcast in January, a lot of the questions we've gotten are around margins and capital expenditures. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:05:48I'll provide some additional color and time on those two items, then Kent will provide a market update. Let's turn to slide nine. Energy Storage EBITDA margins were 65% in 2022. In 2023, a lower impact of spodumene inventory and increased impact of our JVs is expected to normalize our 2023 margins to around 46%-47%. Most of that roughly 20 percentage point decline is due to spodumene inventory lags. It takes about six months for spodumene to go from our mines through conversion to our customers. Last year, we saw dramatic increases in pricing for lithium and spodumene. Due to that timeline on spodumene inventory, we realized higher lithium pricing from our customers faster than higher spodumene costs. As a result, we had unusually strong margins in 2022, particularly in the second half. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:06:53The next item affecting margins is the accounting treatment of the MARBL joint venture. We expect to report 100% of net sales, but only our share of EBITDA, resulting in a lower reported margin on that portion of the business. As this joint venture continues to ramp up, this accounting impact will increase. We are in active discussions with our partner about restructuring the MARBL joint venture and expect to have news on this soon. Our EBITDA margins are impacted by tax expense at our Talison joint venture. Talison income is included in our EBITDA on an after-tax basis. If you adjust Talison results to exclude this, margins would be about 8%-10% higher in 2023. Let's turn to our capital expenditures outlook on slide 10. We are investing with three goals in mind. First, to add conversion capacity and remain vertically integrated. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:07:57Second, to invest in new product technology to support battery advances. Third, to build and maintain our world-class resource base. To meet these goals, we expect capital investment to increase from about $1.7-$1.9 billion in 2023 to about $4-$4.4 billion in 2027. About half the increase in capital expense relates to geographic diversification to support customer demand for regional lithium conversion and supply. In 2023, we're investing in our conversion capacity in Meishan and Qinzhou. As the EV market develops in other parts of the world, we will continue to invest. For example, we are planning investments in North America and Europe, where we estimate capital intensity to be more than double. Second, by mid-decade, we expect to invest more in technology to produce advanced energy storage materials for next-generation batteries. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:09:04Lastly, we expect to invest in additional resource development. Across our capital spending, about 5% is linked to sustainability, including improvements to new and existing facilities. These investments are expected to generate strong returns, allowing us to continue to invest to support our customers while generating significant free cash flow. With that, I'll turn it over to Kent for a brief market update and closing remarks. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:09:37Okay. Thanks, Scott. As China reopens, we expect moderation in EV demand to be short-lived, with medium and long-term demand remaining robust. We continue to expect EV sales in China to grow 40% year-over-year, an increase of nearly 3 million vehicles. As you can see in the chart on the right, sales in China are seasonally weak around the Lunar New Year. We believe the latest phasing out of subsidies will have limited impact on demand. EV subsidies have rolled off on schedule since 2013, with only brief declines in sales. Continued municipal incentives and consumer preferences support a strong demand outlook for EVs. Our contract customers are not slowing down their ordering patterns, and early indications are both that cathode inventory and battery inventory in China are decreasing, which is a good sign for lithium sales. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:10:38We're listening to our customers, and we'll be watching the data, so we'll continue to adjust our expectation as the year progresses. Our biggest challenge is managing the tremendous growth opportunity that is in front of us. We are leveraging our durable competitive advantages, like our world-class resources, our global asset portfolio, and technical know-how to continue to grow. We are being absolutely disciplined about how we build our leadership position, particularly when it comes to scaling lithium production and conversion. We intend to accelerate growth profitably and in ways that align with customer needs. We are confident that electrification will continue to be a primary pathway toward a clean energy future, but we also recognize that the future for Albemarle is built on more than electric vehicles and on more than just our production capacity. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:11:35As we said in our strategic update, our strength in transforming resources into essential elements give us outstanding leadership opportunities in four key areas: mobility, energy, connectivity, and health. We know that customer-focused innovations and sustainability are as essential to our future as our resource capacity as we work to fulfill our purpose of enabling a more resilient world. Now we'll move to Q&A. Glenn, you're going to moderate that. Moderator00:12:09Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please press star followed by one on your telephone keypad now. When preparing to ask your question, please ensure your phone is unmuted locally. We have our first question comes from P.J. Juvekar from Citi. P.J., your line is now open. P.J. JuvekarGlobal Head of Chemicals and Agriculture at Citi00:12:28Yes. Hi, good morning, everyone. Just a long-term question. As you get ready for Kings Mountain site to potentially restart in, let's say, four or five years, I know you're doing a lot of community outreach and engagement today. Can you lay out for us the milestones in terms of permitting process? After the IRA, do you think the process has gotten any easier? Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:12:59All right. Interesting. I mean, we are doing a lot of community outreach. It's not so much about the permitting process. It's just kind of how we're doing business when we go about a project like this. We expect to continue to do that throughout the life of the mine as we do that at other mines and other sites as well. We're just changing a little bit how we do that, learning from some of the success that we've had in the lithium business, and we apply that to our other sites as well, whether we're mining there or not. We'll continue to see that outreach. Has the permitting process gotten easier since the IRA? I think there's attention on it. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:13:36We are hopeful that it may be a little bit easier and streamlined, but we can't say that it's gotten that way yet. I mean, that's my view. Then some of the milestones in permitting, Eric, do you wanna comment on that? Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:13:49Yeah. I guess, P.J., good morning. I think that the first step would be permitting towards the latter half of this year. We've been in feasibility work on an environmental side and sustainability side to prepare for that permit. We have a permitting strategy that, you know, can't get into all the details on here, but I would say leverages the fact that this is a brownfield site. We're optimistic that even though there's, as Ken said, there's tension and an attention on the permitting process that this particular mine, given its brownfield history, will have hopefully a rapid review. We'll continue to monitor that closely and update you accordingly. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:14:37Yeah. Even though we're filing for permits this year, and we've been doing work on gathering data for that process for almost two years, I think. I'm not exactly sure how long, but for quite some time, the data that's necessary for those permits, the history around everything that you have to report on to get the permit. It's a process that takes a little time. Even though we haven't formally filed yet, we've been working on that for a couple of years. P.J. JuvekarGlobal Head of Chemicals and Agriculture at Citi00:15:05Thank you. I'll pass it along. Moderator00:15:10Thank you, P.J. We have our next question comes from David Begleiter from Deutsche Bank. David, your line is now open. David BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank00:15:19Thank you. Good morning. Eric, just on lithium spot price in China, it's not a major focus of yours. We have seen continued softening over the last few weeks. What do you make of that? Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:15:35Good morning, David. I would say it has a lot to do with what Ken described in his remarks. We've come out of a period of time in 2022 of remarkable growth that exceeded expectations in terms of EV production and was going at a pretty heady pace when a decision was taken to reopen the economy. Of course, you know what happened thereafter. I mean, the virus spread quite rapidly, and it did sap consumer demand at a time when seasonally was weak anyway because of the Lunar New Year. I think there's much been made about the subsidies as well rolling off, but those have been rolling off for several years. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:16:12Some of them have been extended at the provincial level, and some of the more meaningful subsidies are at the state and local level anyway. We don't think that that's as big an issue, and we've certainly seen that in prior years have initially a spike in demand immediately before the subsidy comes off, a drop in demand right after it comes off, and then a rebound in demand. Our projection and our customers' view is that this year, particularly in the second half, we'll see that growth that's projected of close to 40%. In the meantime, people are buying under contracts but not venturing into the spot market and in China, bringing their inventories down quite low because we're in this post-holiday period with still some uncertainty in the very near term. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:16:51We expect that to be short-lived, though, with the demand rebound later this year. David BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank00:16:56Oh, very helpful. Scott, just on the full year guidance, thank you for the first half, second half split. Any further thoughts on the Q1 versus Q2 split in EBITDA? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:17:08Yeah, I would expect that Q1 would be stronger than the second quarter. Again, it's really driven by that inventory lag that we're seeing ultimately, as well as, you know, the strong prices in the fourth quarter that carry into the first quarter ultimately. Ultimately, I think the first quarter is a bit stronger than the second quarter. David BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank00:17:32Excellent. Thank you very much. Moderator00:17:36Thank you, David. We have our next question comes from Jeffrey Zekauskas from JPMorgan. Jeff, your line is now open. Jeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorgan00:17:46Thanks very much. If lithium prices remain flat in 2023, is it the case that your equity income from Talison would remain at that $332 level all the way through 2023? Is Talison making as much spodumene as it can make, or is there room for it to move up in 2023 and 2024? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:18:20Yeah, I'll take the equity income question, and maybe Eric, you can take the production question. We'd expect if lithium prices stay flat, we'd actually expect the equity income out of Talison to increase. If you remember, the transfer price out of Talison is on a, at least historically, been on a six-month lag. It's now shifted to a three-month lag. That, you know, the increases that have happened last year will start to flow through in the first half of 2023. I'd expect it to be higher. Eric, you want to talk about production? Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:18:57Yeah. Jeff, with regard to production, you may know that CGP1, their first line has been running for years now, is at max rate. CGP2 came on in the recent past and is ramping a ramp last year. There is possibility for that to run. I mean, the upside would be it can run at slightly better rates. There's some productivity in the bottlenecking activities to make that that they could result in that, although it is running close to capacity. Then there's additional from the tailings reprocess lithium that's being added. It's higher year-on-year, and there's potential for it to be slightly higher if those productivity initiatives are successful. Jeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorgan00:19:35Okay, great. you spoke of your first half and second half lithium EBITDA as being comparable. Given that there's so much more production coming out of Chile, why would that be the case? Shouldn't your volumes be stronger in the second half of 2023? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:20:03Yes. They'll definitely be stronger. It'll be on the basis of the production out of Chile, but also the ramping up of Qinzhou and the conversion there, and then the additional volume that Eric just talked about with Talison. Of course, prices are up, but we're assuming price is flat throughout the year based off of the how we exited 2022. You've got to layer on the cost impacts that I talked about on the call. You've got the spodumene inventory lag that corrects itself this year. You've got, as Qinzhou ramps up, you have a margin rate impact there that just due to the fact that we report 100% of the revenue and only half of the EBITDA. Jeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorgan00:20:51Okay, great. Thank you so much. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:20:54You bet. Moderator00:20:56Thank you, Jeff. With our next question comes from Stephen Richardson from Evercore ISI. Stephen, your line is now open. Stephen RichardsonSenior Managing Director at Evercore ISI00:21:07Hi. Good morning. I was wondering if you could dig in a little bit on the European strategy. You know, it seems, you know, clearly in China you've acquired and built conversion capacity, and in the U.S. looks like things are really centered at Kings Mountain. Could you talk a little bit about Europe in terms of how you're thinking about how this evolves? I know it's early, but, is this an area where we would see you bring material from either Chile or Western Australia? Do you envision yourself partnering, or doing more of a greenfield, as it comes to supplying on the continent? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:21:41I'll start with that. Eric can fill in a little bit. I think you're, I mean, you answered part of the question. We're moving from China, North America. We've got we have resource strategy and a program for North America. We're investing there, and we'll be a similar program in Europe. We don't have the resource base in Europe that we have in North America. We'd like it to be a combination of some local resource, which we don't have at the moment, and then bringing a resource in in some form. That's most likely gonna be from Chile and Western Australia because that's where the big resource bases are at the moment. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:22:20We just got to work out the strategy of how we bring that in the most economically and the most sustainable way that we can. That's gonna be about the strategy with the assets that we put on the ground in Australia. Eric can talk about partnering. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:22:33Stephen, it would be a greenfield site as there really are no brownfield sites for such capacity in Europe today. We've gone through site selection process and looked at numerous countries and haven't drawn that down close enough yet to make an announcement or to say anything publicly further about it. That being said, it would be a plant that would be modeled very intentionally after what we've done here in North America, or we want to do in North America, I should say. Run a plant that is able to process a variety of different feedstocks. Kent mentioned Chile. That would be a carbonate feed or spodumene or derivative of spodumene coming from Australia into Europe, and also have an ability to have recycling. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:23:17We very much view that kind of a strategy being one that has an opportunity for a partner, whether that be an OEM, or other producers in the battery supply chain in the region. We don't have anything further we can say about that, but that's an effort that remains underway in terms of how we might partner to bring about that closed loop process in addition to the sort of the virgin, lithium production we intend to put on the continent. Stephen RichardsonSenior Managing Director at Evercore ISI00:23:45Appreciate the color. Thanks. If I could just, I'll get 1 follow-up. I appreciate the comments off the top in terms of the CapEx outlook. One of the questions that we feel that on this is, it's clear that this CapEx outlook is a function of looking at, you know, the current environment or I think you used year-end 2022 environment for pricing going forward. Important to realize that you're not obligated to spend this $4.4 billion in 2027. I guess the 1 point of clarification is that a peak for CapEx based on the project queue that you're looking at? Like, does CapEx come down in 2028, 2029 based on that cadence of project spend? Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:24:27Yeah. I would say, I mean, you're right. We're not committed to it, so we will look as things evolve and go. That's our best view. We put a five-year plan out there. That's our best view, the best view of what we'd be doing over five years. Any capital that we'll be investing in 27 will be for 31, 32 market. It's a pretty long way to be able to predict that from here. It's we don't wanna go past that five-year forecast that we put out there. It could level off. I mean, it just depends on what the market looks like. We'll know a lot more in five years' time than we do today. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:25:06Any capital we're spending in 27 is, you know, that's for 32 or 31, whatever the timeframe is around that. Then it's important to note that our CapEx program becomes more resource-oriented. I mean, it's been conversion in the near term because we've had the resource. It'll be more balanced between conversion and resource as we get out into that timeframe. Moderator00:25:29Thank you. Thank you, Stephen. Our next question comes from Christopher Parkinson from Mizuho. Christopher, your line is now open. Christopher ParkinsonManaging Director at Mizuho00:25:42Great. Thank you so much. Can you just give a little bit more incremental information on how we should be thinking about the ramps at both Kemerton and Qinzhou and whether or not there's any just very brief update of thought process on your, you know, additional capacity optionalities, especially in the United States, through the balance of the decade? Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:26:10I guess, I mean, Qinzhou is operating, and it will ramp up, so there are make rights we have to do there. Even we're operating today, we'll have to take it down to do those make rights to get additional volume. There's a potential to expand at Qinzhou as well, but that's not a project that we're executing at the moment. We wanna get the up to speed and operating. It's operating today, and it will ramp up over the next year, I think to kind of the full capacity, acquisition capacity, which is around we target at 25,000 tons. Kemerton is making product today, but we're not selling any product because we need to get qualification from our customers. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:26:54That's where we are. Then that will ramp over time. The strategy originally, the strategy at Kemerton was to execute the both trains simultaneously. We've bifurcated that because we'd struggled with labor during the pandemic and still, frankly, struggle with labor at Kemerton. We're sequencing the commissioning and implementation. Train one is operating and making product. Train two is not, and it's probably six months behind train one, I would say. Then that will ramp over time. We've always said we ramp those projects. We plan to those projects to ramp from start up to full capacity over a two-year period, and I think that's probably the still the rule of thumb that we're following. Is there another part of the question? Christopher ParkinsonManaging Director at Mizuho00:27:40Yeah. Just any updated thought process on your additional projects that you could assess specifically in the U.S. over the next few years? Just any updated thoughts. That's all. Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:27:51Yeah. Yeah. Probably nothing new since the call a few weeks ago. We're still looking at the site selection for a conversion facility to convert the Kings Mountain ore. Silver Peak, we've expanded, and it's operating at that expansion rate. Maybe a little bit more ramp up to do at Silver Peak, but it's operating at that higher rate. The other would be Magnolia for... and that is a little bit further out, but we're making progress there and planning that project, but we've not kicked it off from an FID standpoint yet. Christopher ParkinsonManaging Director at Mizuho00:28:29Very helpful. Thank you so much. Moderator00:28:33Thank you, Christopher. With our last question comes from John Roberts from Credit Suisse. John, your line is now open. John RobertsManaging Director at Credit Suisse00:28:42Thank you. I think your guidance is based on the December 31st realized price. I just wanna clarify, the equity income within that guidance is based on price rising through the 1st quarter because of the lag, for the remaining quarters of 2023, the equity income has a flat price after that lag's recovered? Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:29:06It actually on the equity income, it actually goes up in the first half, through the first half. We'll see volume metric and, you know, increases out of that as well. It actually increases through the year sequentially. John RobertsManaging Director at Credit Suisse00:29:24Okay. Then any update on the negotiations with Mineral Resources on the MARBL JV? Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:29:34Not a real update. Scott had said in his comments that we continue to talk with our partners and that we expect to be able to announce something soon, but nothing for today. John RobertsManaging Director at Credit Suisse00:29:46Okay. Thank you. Moderator00:29:49Thank you, John. Ladies and gentlemen, that's all the time we have for questions. I will now pass the floor back to Kent Masters for closing remarks. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:30:00Okay. Thank you. As you heard today and during our January webcast, we feel we have the right strategy, the operating model, and the people to meet this opportunity and manage our business successfully to grow today and well into the future. Thank you for joining your call and your interest in Albemarle. Thank you. Moderator00:30:25Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's call. Thank you for joining. You may now disconnect your lines.Read moreParticipantsExecutivesMeredith BandyVP of Investor Relations and SustainabilityKent MastersCEOScott TozierCFOEric NorrisCCOAnalystsModeratorP.J. JuvekarGlobal Head of Chemicals and Agriculture at CitiDavid BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche BankJeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorganStephen RichardsonSenior Managing Director at Evercore ISIChristopher ParkinsonManaging Director at MizuhoJohn RobertsManaging Director at Credit SuissePowered by Earnings DocumentsSlide DeckPress Release(8-K)Annual report(10-K) Albemarle Q4 2022 Earnings FAQ Did Albemarle beat earnings estimates for Q4 2022? Albemarle (NYSE:ALB) reported earnings of $8.62 per share for Q4 2022, beating the consensus estimate of $8.46. The report was announced on Thursday, February 16, 2023. What was Albemarle's revenue for Q4 2022? Albemarle reported revenue of $2.62 billion for Q4 2022, against a consensus estimate of $2.60 billion. Where can I read Albemarle's Q4 2022 earnings call transcript? The full Albemarle Q4 2022 earnings conference call transcript is published on this page, including prepared remarks and the analyst Q&A session, along with the participants who spoke on the call. Albemarle Earnings HeadlinesAre Wall Street analysts predicting Albemarle stock will climb or sink?1 hour ago | msn.comWhat is Scotiabank's Estimate for Albemarle FY2026 Earnings?November 13 at 2:16 AM | americanbankingnews.comI'm handing you this stock todayElon doesn't own the chip inside his Teslas or Starlink dishes. He licenses it from one little known public company. Now he's planning 1,000,000 AI satellites in orbit, and every one could pay this company a royalty. Analyst Dylan says the window to get in closes around December 8th, before new money floods into the buildout.November 13 at 1:00 AM | Behind the Markets (Ad)Albemarle (NYSE:ALB) Stock Price Target Cut by UBS GroupNovember 11 at 1:25 AM | americanbankingnews.comAlbemarle (NYSE:ALB) Stock Price Target Cut by Morgan StanleyNovember 11 at 1:24 AM | americanbankingnews.comAlbemarle (NYSE:ALB) Stock Gets Price Target Boost from CitigroupNovember 11 at 1:24 AM | americanbankingnews.comSee More Albemarle Headlines Get Earnings Announcements in your inboxWant to stay updated on the latest earnings announcements and upcoming reports for companies like Albemarle? Sign up for Earnings360's daily newsletter to receive timely earnings updates on Albemarle and other key companies, straight to your email. Email Address About AlbemarleAlbemarle (NYSE:ALB) is a specialty chemicals company that produces lithium, bromine and refining catalysts. Its products serve industries including energy storage, transportation, electronics, petroleum refining and pharmaceuticals.The company supplies lithium compounds used in rechargeable batteries and other applications. It also makes bromine-based products for uses such as flame retardants and water treatment, along with catalysts used in refining petroleum.Albemarle traces its history to 1887 and is headquartered in Charlotte, North Carolina. 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PresentationSkip to Participants Moderator00:00:00Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Albemarle Corporation Q4 2022 Earnings Call. My name is Glenn, and I'll be the moderator for today's call. If you would like to ask a question during the presentation, you may do so by pressing star one on a touch tone keypad. I'll now hand you over to your host, Meredith Bandy, Vice President of Investor Relations and Sustainability. Meredith, please go ahead. Meredith BandyVP of Investor Relations and Sustainability at Albemarle00:00:25All right. Thank you, Glenn, and welcome everyone to Albemarle's 4th quarter and full year 2022 earnings conference call. Our earnings were released after the close of market yesterday, and you will find the press release and earnings presentation posted to our website under the investors section at albemarle.com. Joining me on the call today are Kent Masters, Chief Executive Officer, and Scott Tozier, Chief Financial Officer. Raphael Crawford, President of Ketjen, Netha Johnson, President of Specialties, and Eric Norris, President of Energy Storage, are also available for Q&A. I'll note that today's call will be limited to 30 minutes, shorter than our usual quarterly updates since we just held an in-depth update about 3 weeks ago. The replay of that webcast is available on our website. Meredith BandyVP of Investor Relations and Sustainability at Albemarle00:01:12As a reminder, some of the statements made during this call, including our outlook, guidance, expected company performance, and timing of the expansion projects, may constitute forward-looking statements. Please note the cautionary language about forward-looking statements contained in our press release and earnings presentation. That same language applies to this call. I'll also note that some of our comments today refer to non-GAAP financial measures. A reconciliation to GAAP financial measures can be found in our earnings release and the appendix of our earnings presentation. With that, I'll turn the call over to Kent. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:01:47Thanks, Meredith. Good morning, and thank you for joining us today. I'll start by highlighting that our fourth quarter results were exceptional, with close to triple the net sales from the same period in 2021 and adjusted EBITDA up more than 400% year-over-year. While rising lithium pricing contributed to these results, we also saw significant increased volume growth. Scott will go into the financial details for the quarter and the year. We are confident in our assessment of the market opportunity for our essential elements and equally confident of our ability to seize that opportunity. We anticipate net sales growth of 55%-75% for 2023. Our strategy is not just to maintain, but to build on our global leadership in both Energy Storage and Specialties, we continue to invest in both capacity and innovation to make that happen. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:02:48Now I'll turn over to Scott for the details. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:02:51Great. Thanks, Kent. Good morning, everyone. Let's start on slide 5 to quickly review the fourth quarter 2022 performance. Net sales for the fourth quarter closed at approximately $2.6 billion, up 193% from last year, driven primarily by our lithium segment, but we saw increases in bromine as well. Net income attributable to Albemarle was $1.1 billion for the fourth quarter. Diluted EPS for the fourth quarter was $9.60, which was a record for Albemarle. In fact, it easily beat our previous full year EPS record of $6.34 back in 2018. Turning to slide six. Fourth quarter adjusted EBITDA was over $1.2 billion, up almost five and a half times year-over-year. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:03:44This $1 billion increase was primarily driven by higher lithium prices and increased volumes. As you can see on the slide, these high quarterly results also contributed heavily to our full year increase in adjusted EBITDA of nearly 300%. Our bromine segment was up slightly. As expected, our catalyst segment came in lower in the quarter as higher sales volumes and favorable pricing were offset by a plant shutdown due to the winter freeze in Texas in December. Full year 2023 guidance is unchanged from our strategic update in January. We continue to expect strong sequential sales growth in 2023. Remember, we have assumed flat year-end 2022 lithium pricing throughout 2023. We expect our adjusted EBITDA to be approximately 20%-45% higher than 2022, with positive trends in all three businesses. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:04:50Additionally, we expect net cash from operations to rise between 10% and 25% over 2022. This means we expect to remain free cash flow positive this year, even after increasing our growth investments. On slide eight, we expect to see net sales increase sequentially quarter-to-quarter as our volumes ramp up. We project that our adjusted EBITDA will be evenly split between the first and second halves of the year. As a result, we anticipate that margin rates will moderate as we progress through the year, and I'll come back to that in a moment. All three of our business segments are looking at healthy growth rates during the year, reiterating what we detailed in our January event. Since our webcast in January, a lot of the questions we've gotten are around margins and capital expenditures. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:05:48I'll provide some additional color and time on those two items, then Kent will provide a market update. Let's turn to slide nine. Energy Storage EBITDA margins were 65% in 2022. In 2023, a lower impact of spodumene inventory and increased impact of our JVs is expected to normalize our 2023 margins to around 46%-47%. Most of that roughly 20 percentage point decline is due to spodumene inventory lags. It takes about six months for spodumene to go from our mines through conversion to our customers. Last year, we saw dramatic increases in pricing for lithium and spodumene. Due to that timeline on spodumene inventory, we realized higher lithium pricing from our customers faster than higher spodumene costs. As a result, we had unusually strong margins in 2022, particularly in the second half. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:06:53The next item affecting margins is the accounting treatment of the MARBL joint venture. We expect to report 100% of net sales, but only our share of EBITDA, resulting in a lower reported margin on that portion of the business. As this joint venture continues to ramp up, this accounting impact will increase. We are in active discussions with our partner about restructuring the MARBL joint venture and expect to have news on this soon. Our EBITDA margins are impacted by tax expense at our Talison joint venture. Talison income is included in our EBITDA on an after-tax basis. If you adjust Talison results to exclude this, margins would be about 8%-10% higher in 2023. Let's turn to our capital expenditures outlook on slide 10. We are investing with three goals in mind. First, to add conversion capacity and remain vertically integrated. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:07:57Second, to invest in new product technology to support battery advances. Third, to build and maintain our world-class resource base. To meet these goals, we expect capital investment to increase from about $1.7-$1.9 billion in 2023 to about $4-$4.4 billion in 2027. About half the increase in capital expense relates to geographic diversification to support customer demand for regional lithium conversion and supply. In 2023, we're investing in our conversion capacity in Meishan and Qinzhou. As the EV market develops in other parts of the world, we will continue to invest. For example, we are planning investments in North America and Europe, where we estimate capital intensity to be more than double. Second, by mid-decade, we expect to invest more in technology to produce advanced energy storage materials for next-generation batteries. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:09:04Lastly, we expect to invest in additional resource development. Across our capital spending, about 5% is linked to sustainability, including improvements to new and existing facilities. These investments are expected to generate strong returns, allowing us to continue to invest to support our customers while generating significant free cash flow. With that, I'll turn it over to Kent for a brief market update and closing remarks. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:09:37Okay. Thanks, Scott. As China reopens, we expect moderation in EV demand to be short-lived, with medium and long-term demand remaining robust. We continue to expect EV sales in China to grow 40% year-over-year, an increase of nearly 3 million vehicles. As you can see in the chart on the right, sales in China are seasonally weak around the Lunar New Year. We believe the latest phasing out of subsidies will have limited impact on demand. EV subsidies have rolled off on schedule since 2013, with only brief declines in sales. Continued municipal incentives and consumer preferences support a strong demand outlook for EVs. Our contract customers are not slowing down their ordering patterns, and early indications are both that cathode inventory and battery inventory in China are decreasing, which is a good sign for lithium sales. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:10:38We're listening to our customers, and we'll be watching the data, so we'll continue to adjust our expectation as the year progresses. Our biggest challenge is managing the tremendous growth opportunity that is in front of us. We are leveraging our durable competitive advantages, like our world-class resources, our global asset portfolio, and technical know-how to continue to grow. We are being absolutely disciplined about how we build our leadership position, particularly when it comes to scaling lithium production and conversion. We intend to accelerate growth profitably and in ways that align with customer needs. We are confident that electrification will continue to be a primary pathway toward a clean energy future, but we also recognize that the future for Albemarle is built on more than electric vehicles and on more than just our production capacity. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:11:35As we said in our strategic update, our strength in transforming resources into essential elements give us outstanding leadership opportunities in four key areas: mobility, energy, connectivity, and health. We know that customer-focused innovations and sustainability are as essential to our future as our resource capacity as we work to fulfill our purpose of enabling a more resilient world. Now we'll move to Q&A. Glenn, you're going to moderate that. Moderator00:12:09Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please press star followed by one on your telephone keypad now. When preparing to ask your question, please ensure your phone is unmuted locally. We have our first question comes from P.J. Juvekar from Citi. P.J., your line is now open. P.J. JuvekarGlobal Head of Chemicals and Agriculture at Citi00:12:28Yes. Hi, good morning, everyone. Just a long-term question. As you get ready for Kings Mountain site to potentially restart in, let's say, four or five years, I know you're doing a lot of community outreach and engagement today. Can you lay out for us the milestones in terms of permitting process? After the IRA, do you think the process has gotten any easier? Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:12:59All right. Interesting. I mean, we are doing a lot of community outreach. It's not so much about the permitting process. It's just kind of how we're doing business when we go about a project like this. We expect to continue to do that throughout the life of the mine as we do that at other mines and other sites as well. We're just changing a little bit how we do that, learning from some of the success that we've had in the lithium business, and we apply that to our other sites as well, whether we're mining there or not. We'll continue to see that outreach. Has the permitting process gotten easier since the IRA? I think there's attention on it. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:13:36We are hopeful that it may be a little bit easier and streamlined, but we can't say that it's gotten that way yet. I mean, that's my view. Then some of the milestones in permitting, Eric, do you wanna comment on that? Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:13:49Yeah. I guess, P.J., good morning. I think that the first step would be permitting towards the latter half of this year. We've been in feasibility work on an environmental side and sustainability side to prepare for that permit. We have a permitting strategy that, you know, can't get into all the details on here, but I would say leverages the fact that this is a brownfield site. We're optimistic that even though there's, as Ken said, there's tension and an attention on the permitting process that this particular mine, given its brownfield history, will have hopefully a rapid review. We'll continue to monitor that closely and update you accordingly. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:14:37Yeah. Even though we're filing for permits this year, and we've been doing work on gathering data for that process for almost two years, I think. I'm not exactly sure how long, but for quite some time, the data that's necessary for those permits, the history around everything that you have to report on to get the permit. It's a process that takes a little time. Even though we haven't formally filed yet, we've been working on that for a couple of years. P.J. JuvekarGlobal Head of Chemicals and Agriculture at Citi00:15:05Thank you. I'll pass it along. Moderator00:15:10Thank you, P.J. We have our next question comes from David Begleiter from Deutsche Bank. David, your line is now open. David BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank00:15:19Thank you. Good morning. Eric, just on lithium spot price in China, it's not a major focus of yours. We have seen continued softening over the last few weeks. What do you make of that? Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:15:35Good morning, David. I would say it has a lot to do with what Ken described in his remarks. We've come out of a period of time in 2022 of remarkable growth that exceeded expectations in terms of EV production and was going at a pretty heady pace when a decision was taken to reopen the economy. Of course, you know what happened thereafter. I mean, the virus spread quite rapidly, and it did sap consumer demand at a time when seasonally was weak anyway because of the Lunar New Year. I think there's much been made about the subsidies as well rolling off, but those have been rolling off for several years. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:16:12Some of them have been extended at the provincial level, and some of the more meaningful subsidies are at the state and local level anyway. We don't think that that's as big an issue, and we've certainly seen that in prior years have initially a spike in demand immediately before the subsidy comes off, a drop in demand right after it comes off, and then a rebound in demand. Our projection and our customers' view is that this year, particularly in the second half, we'll see that growth that's projected of close to 40%. In the meantime, people are buying under contracts but not venturing into the spot market and in China, bringing their inventories down quite low because we're in this post-holiday period with still some uncertainty in the very near term. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:16:51We expect that to be short-lived, though, with the demand rebound later this year. David BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank00:16:56Oh, very helpful. Scott, just on the full year guidance, thank you for the first half, second half split. Any further thoughts on the Q1 versus Q2 split in EBITDA? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:17:08Yeah, I would expect that Q1 would be stronger than the second quarter. Again, it's really driven by that inventory lag that we're seeing ultimately, as well as, you know, the strong prices in the fourth quarter that carry into the first quarter ultimately. Ultimately, I think the first quarter is a bit stronger than the second quarter. David BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank00:17:32Excellent. Thank you very much. Moderator00:17:36Thank you, David. We have our next question comes from Jeffrey Zekauskas from JPMorgan. Jeff, your line is now open. Jeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorgan00:17:46Thanks very much. If lithium prices remain flat in 2023, is it the case that your equity income from Talison would remain at that $332 level all the way through 2023? Is Talison making as much spodumene as it can make, or is there room for it to move up in 2023 and 2024? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:18:20Yeah, I'll take the equity income question, and maybe Eric, you can take the production question. We'd expect if lithium prices stay flat, we'd actually expect the equity income out of Talison to increase. If you remember, the transfer price out of Talison is on a, at least historically, been on a six-month lag. It's now shifted to a three-month lag. That, you know, the increases that have happened last year will start to flow through in the first half of 2023. I'd expect it to be higher. Eric, you want to talk about production? Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:18:57Yeah. Jeff, with regard to production, you may know that CGP1, their first line has been running for years now, is at max rate. CGP2 came on in the recent past and is ramping a ramp last year. There is possibility for that to run. I mean, the upside would be it can run at slightly better rates. There's some productivity in the bottlenecking activities to make that that they could result in that, although it is running close to capacity. Then there's additional from the tailings reprocess lithium that's being added. It's higher year-on-year, and there's potential for it to be slightly higher if those productivity initiatives are successful. Jeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorgan00:19:35Okay, great. you spoke of your first half and second half lithium EBITDA as being comparable. Given that there's so much more production coming out of Chile, why would that be the case? Shouldn't your volumes be stronger in the second half of 2023? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:20:03Yes. They'll definitely be stronger. It'll be on the basis of the production out of Chile, but also the ramping up of Qinzhou and the conversion there, and then the additional volume that Eric just talked about with Talison. Of course, prices are up, but we're assuming price is flat throughout the year based off of the how we exited 2022. You've got to layer on the cost impacts that I talked about on the call. You've got the spodumene inventory lag that corrects itself this year. You've got, as Qinzhou ramps up, you have a margin rate impact there that just due to the fact that we report 100% of the revenue and only half of the EBITDA. Jeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorgan00:20:51Okay, great. Thank you so much. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:20:54You bet. Moderator00:20:56Thank you, Jeff. With our next question comes from Stephen Richardson from Evercore ISI. Stephen, your line is now open. Stephen RichardsonSenior Managing Director at Evercore ISI00:21:07Hi. Good morning. I was wondering if you could dig in a little bit on the European strategy. You know, it seems, you know, clearly in China you've acquired and built conversion capacity, and in the U.S. looks like things are really centered at Kings Mountain. Could you talk a little bit about Europe in terms of how you're thinking about how this evolves? I know it's early, but, is this an area where we would see you bring material from either Chile or Western Australia? Do you envision yourself partnering, or doing more of a greenfield, as it comes to supplying on the continent? Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:21:41I'll start with that. Eric can fill in a little bit. I think you're, I mean, you answered part of the question. We're moving from China, North America. We've got we have resource strategy and a program for North America. We're investing there, and we'll be a similar program in Europe. We don't have the resource base in Europe that we have in North America. We'd like it to be a combination of some local resource, which we don't have at the moment, and then bringing a resource in in some form. That's most likely gonna be from Chile and Western Australia because that's where the big resource bases are at the moment. Scott TozierCFO at Albemarle00:22:20We just got to work out the strategy of how we bring that in the most economically and the most sustainable way that we can. That's gonna be about the strategy with the assets that we put on the ground in Australia. Eric can talk about partnering. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:22:33Stephen, it would be a greenfield site as there really are no brownfield sites for such capacity in Europe today. We've gone through site selection process and looked at numerous countries and haven't drawn that down close enough yet to make an announcement or to say anything publicly further about it. That being said, it would be a plant that would be modeled very intentionally after what we've done here in North America, or we want to do in North America, I should say. Run a plant that is able to process a variety of different feedstocks. Kent mentioned Chile. That would be a carbonate feed or spodumene or derivative of spodumene coming from Australia into Europe, and also have an ability to have recycling. Eric NorrisCCO at Albemarle00:23:17We very much view that kind of a strategy being one that has an opportunity for a partner, whether that be an OEM, or other producers in the battery supply chain in the region. We don't have anything further we can say about that, but that's an effort that remains underway in terms of how we might partner to bring about that closed loop process in addition to the sort of the virgin, lithium production we intend to put on the continent. Stephen RichardsonSenior Managing Director at Evercore ISI00:23:45Appreciate the color. Thanks. If I could just, I'll get 1 follow-up. I appreciate the comments off the top in terms of the CapEx outlook. One of the questions that we feel that on this is, it's clear that this CapEx outlook is a function of looking at, you know, the current environment or I think you used year-end 2022 environment for pricing going forward. Important to realize that you're not obligated to spend this $4.4 billion in 2027. I guess the 1 point of clarification is that a peak for CapEx based on the project queue that you're looking at? Like, does CapEx come down in 2028, 2029 based on that cadence of project spend? Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:24:27Yeah. I would say, I mean, you're right. We're not committed to it, so we will look as things evolve and go. That's our best view. We put a five-year plan out there. That's our best view, the best view of what we'd be doing over five years. Any capital that we'll be investing in 27 will be for 31, 32 market. It's a pretty long way to be able to predict that from here. It's we don't wanna go past that five-year forecast that we put out there. It could level off. I mean, it just depends on what the market looks like. We'll know a lot more in five years' time than we do today. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:25:06Any capital we're spending in 27 is, you know, that's for 32 or 31, whatever the timeframe is around that. Then it's important to note that our CapEx program becomes more resource-oriented. I mean, it's been conversion in the near term because we've had the resource. It'll be more balanced between conversion and resource as we get out into that timeframe. Moderator00:25:29Thank you. Thank you, Stephen. Our next question comes from Christopher Parkinson from Mizuho. Christopher, your line is now open. Christopher ParkinsonManaging Director at Mizuho00:25:42Great. Thank you so much. Can you just give a little bit more incremental information on how we should be thinking about the ramps at both Kemerton and Qinzhou and whether or not there's any just very brief update of thought process on your, you know, additional capacity optionalities, especially in the United States, through the balance of the decade? Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:26:10I guess, I mean, Qinzhou is operating, and it will ramp up, so there are make rights we have to do there. Even we're operating today, we'll have to take it down to do those make rights to get additional volume. There's a potential to expand at Qinzhou as well, but that's not a project that we're executing at the moment. We wanna get the up to speed and operating. It's operating today, and it will ramp up over the next year, I think to kind of the full capacity, acquisition capacity, which is around we target at 25,000 tons. Kemerton is making product today, but we're not selling any product because we need to get qualification from our customers. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:26:54That's where we are. Then that will ramp over time. The strategy originally, the strategy at Kemerton was to execute the both trains simultaneously. We've bifurcated that because we'd struggled with labor during the pandemic and still, frankly, struggle with labor at Kemerton. We're sequencing the commissioning and implementation. Train one is operating and making product. Train two is not, and it's probably six months behind train one, I would say. Then that will ramp over time. We've always said we ramp those projects. We plan to those projects to ramp from start up to full capacity over a two-year period, and I think that's probably the still the rule of thumb that we're following. Is there another part of the question? Christopher ParkinsonManaging Director at Mizuho00:27:40Yeah. Just any updated thought process on your additional projects that you could assess specifically in the U.S. over the next few years? Just any updated thoughts. That's all. Thank you. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:27:51Yeah. Yeah. Probably nothing new since the call a few weeks ago. We're still looking at the site selection for a conversion facility to convert the Kings Mountain ore. Silver Peak, we've expanded, and it's operating at that expansion rate. Maybe a little bit more ramp up to do at Silver Peak, but it's operating at that higher rate. The other would be Magnolia for... and that is a little bit further out, but we're making progress there and planning that project, but we've not kicked it off from an FID standpoint yet. Christopher ParkinsonManaging Director at Mizuho00:28:29Very helpful. Thank you so much. Moderator00:28:33Thank you, Christopher. With our last question comes from John Roberts from Credit Suisse. John, your line is now open. John RobertsManaging Director at Credit Suisse00:28:42Thank you. I think your guidance is based on the December 31st realized price. I just wanna clarify, the equity income within that guidance is based on price rising through the 1st quarter because of the lag, for the remaining quarters of 2023, the equity income has a flat price after that lag's recovered? Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:29:06It actually on the equity income, it actually goes up in the first half, through the first half. We'll see volume metric and, you know, increases out of that as well. It actually increases through the year sequentially. John RobertsManaging Director at Credit Suisse00:29:24Okay. Then any update on the negotiations with Mineral Resources on the MARBL JV? Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:29:34Not a real update. Scott had said in his comments that we continue to talk with our partners and that we expect to be able to announce something soon, but nothing for today. John RobertsManaging Director at Credit Suisse00:29:46Okay. Thank you. Moderator00:29:49Thank you, John. Ladies and gentlemen, that's all the time we have for questions. I will now pass the floor back to Kent Masters for closing remarks. Kent MastersCEO at Albemarle00:30:00Okay. Thank you. As you heard today and during our January webcast, we feel we have the right strategy, the operating model, and the people to meet this opportunity and manage our business successfully to grow today and well into the future. Thank you for joining your call and your interest in Albemarle. Thank you. Moderator00:30:25Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's call. Thank you for joining. You may now disconnect your lines.Read moreParticipantsExecutivesMeredith BandyVP of Investor Relations and SustainabilityKent MastersCEOScott TozierCFOEric NorrisCCOAnalystsModeratorP.J. JuvekarGlobal Head of Chemicals and Agriculture at CitiDavid BegleiterManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche BankJeffrey ZekauskasManaging Director and Senior Equity Research Analyst at JPMorganStephen RichardsonSenior Managing Director at Evercore ISIChristopher ParkinsonManaging Director at MizuhoJohn RobertsManaging Director at Credit SuissePowered by