Ares Capital Q3 2023 Earnings Call Transcript

Quartr
Provided by Quartr
October 24, 2023

There are 15 speakers on the call.

Operator

Good afternoon. Welcome to the Ares Capital Corporation's Third Quarter September 30, 2023 Earnings Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in a listen only mode. As a reminder, this conference is being recorded on Tuesday, October 24, 2023. I will now turn the call over to your host, Mr.

Operator

John Stilmar, Managing Director of Ares Investor Relations. Thank you. You may begin.

Speaker 1

Thank you. Let me start with some important reminders. Comments made during the course of this conference call and webcast Please also note that past performance or market information is not a guarantee of future results. During this conference call, the company may discuss certain non GAAP measures as defined by SEC Regulation G, such as core earnings per share or core EPS. The company believes that core EPS provides useful information to investors regarding financial performance because it is one method the company uses to measure its financial condition and results of operations.

Speaker 1

A reconciliation of GAAP net income per share, the most directly comparable GAAP financial measure to core EPS can be found on the accompanying slide presentation for this call. In addition, reconciliation of these measures may also be found in our earnings release filed this morning with the SEC on Certain information discussed in this conference call and the accompanying slide presentation, including information related to portfolio companies, was derived from third party sources It has not been independently verified and accordingly the company makes no representations or warranties with respect to this information. The company's Q3 September 30, 2023 earnings presentation can be found on the company's website at www. Areescapitalcorp.com by clicking on the Q3 2023 earnings presentation link on the homepage of the Investor Resources section. Ares Capital Corporation's earnings release and Form 10 Q are also available on the company's website.

Speaker 1

I'll now turn it over to Mr. Kipp DeVeer, Ares Capital Corporation's Chief Executive Officer.

Speaker 2

Thanks, John. Hello, everyone, and thanks for joining our earnings call today. I'm here with our Co Presidents, Mitch Goldstein and Cort Schnabel Our Chief Financial Officer, Penny Roll our Chief Operating Officer, Janna Markowitz and other members of the management team. Before I begin my prepared remarks on the company, I'd like to express our deepest sympathies to those who have been affected by the recent horrific terrorist attacks in Israel and the subsequent loss of innocent lives. It's truly a tragedy and we hope that a peaceful resolution is achieved as soon as possible.

Speaker 2

Turning to our results, I'll start with some highlights from our Q3 and then add some thoughts on the economic environment and the current market. This morning, we reported strong Q3 results. Our core earnings per share of $0.59 increased 18% year over year, primarily reflecting higher net interest and dividend income, largely a result of higher base interest rates. Our GAAP earnings per share for the Q3 were $0.89 driven by our strong core earnings and an increase in the overall value of our investment portfolio. These results led to another quarter of sequential growth in our net asset value per share to $18.99 which has increased 3% since the beginning of the year.

Speaker 2

We remain one of the few BDCs that's been able to deliver consistent or growing regular dividend while building NAV over long periods of time. We're pleased with these results and we think it's important To put them in the context of what we're seeing in the broader credit markets, for much of the quarter, the credit markets remain constructive and saw some lift As the soft landing narrative for the U. S. Economy led to enhanced liquidity and modestly higher transaction activity. However, with expectation that higher for longer interest rates will be required to tame inflation, Volatility has returned to the capital markets.

Speaker 2

There is no doubt the unsettled international landscape In Ukraine and Israel in particular are adding to this volatility. As a result, the leveraged finance market is less constructive to new transactions, particularly smaller ones and companies that sought the bank and liquid credit markets for their financing needs are turning to the Private credit markets looking for worthy partners that can deliver a higher certainty of closing. Underscoring the market opportunity for direct lenders, This was the 3rd most active quarter in history for $1,000,000,000 plus unitranche transactions and the private credit markets demonstrated the ability to provide a $5,000,000,000 financing solution in the Finastra transaction. Driven by the scale and capabilities of managers like Ares, Private credit is continuing to gain market share over bank and syndicated capital market solutions. During the Q3, market pricing and terms continue to be Leverage levels are lower and equity contributions are at historical highs.

Speaker 2

Looking forward, we're optimistic about the outlook For new investment opportunities and we expect an uptick in M and A and additional sponsor to sponsored portfolio company sales to accelerate in 2024. Given the robust level of private equity dry powder that has largely gone unspent, growing pressure from private equity LPs seeking returns of their capital And stronger sentiment amongst middle market companies to invest in the growth of their businesses, we expect stronger transaction volume in 2024. The simple turning of the calendar year will also help. We would expect the 4th quarter will be moderately better than the 3rd quarter in terms of volume, but likely below 4th quarters of past years. We believe that our experience, scale And capabilities position us well to benefit from these market dynamics.

Speaker 2

Ares Management has continued to invest in the quality and growth of its direct lending platform, And we continue to focus on both sponsored and non sponsored companies and the expansion of our specialty industry coverage. Leveraging what we believe is the largest and most tenured U. S. Direct lending team in the market with 180 professionals across the U. S, We feel that our broad sourcing capabilities provide significant and differentiated deal flow.

Speaker 2

As an example, in the Q3, We reviewed more transactions that were reported in both the leverage loan and the middle market combined. We believe these sourcing advantages allow us to in a highly selective approach, which in turn drives strong long term investment performance. These sourcing capabilities have been a key driver to what we believe is a high quality diversified portfolio. Our companies are continuing to perform well Despite the increase in borrowing costs, our portfolio interest coverage ratio measured using current market interest rates at the end of the quarter was stable quarter over quarter and substantially all of our companies are consistently making their interest payments despite the higher base rates. We'd also note that the weighted average portfolio grade is flat quarter over quarter and remains better than our 15 year average.

Speaker 2

Our non accruals at cost are just over 1% and continue to be well below our own and BDC averages for the past 15 years. In addition, amendment activity and modifications remained stable at historical levels. The credit strength in our portfolio is supported by healthy levels of EBITDA growth across our portfolio companies, which we believe are demonstrating Comparatively stronger growth in the broader market due to the industries that we tend to overweight and our defensive positioning. Our simple strategy of avoiding cyclical sectors more prone to default continues to pay dividends for the company. We estimate that the weighted average LTV in our loan portfolio is around 43%, although we acknowledge The valuation environment is changing in response to higher rates.

Speaker 2

But regardless of these shifting valuations, we have confidence there is Significant value beneath us in most capital structures, a lot of it supplied by large and well established private equity firms with whom we have strong relationships and do repeat business. In situations where we have asked sponsors to step up and support their portfolio companies, We've been pleased with sponsors' willingness and ability to provide capital. Despite this constructive view on the portfolio and the economy generally as credit investors, we are laser focused on ensuring we are well prepared in the event of a more protracted economic downturn. In addition to the benefits of our diversified and defensive portfolio, We have a large portfolio management and valuation team, which supports our investment teams and is proactive in identifying problems early and developing strategies to maximize our outcomes. Our balance sheet remains strong with net debt to equity levels of around 1x.

Speaker 2

We have ample access to capital to invest in this attractive vintage. Importantly, we also have access to capital to deal with more challenging situations as In tougher situations, we believe we have the appropriate resources to execute on our demonstrated playbook for managing the portfolio. We believe these risk management workout capabilities are central to our ability to continue to deliver on our industry leading track record for credit Given these dynamics and the company's overall positioning, we feel good about our Q3 results and are positioned looking forward. And with that, let me turn the call over to Penny to provide some more details on our financial results and our balance sheet position.

Speaker 3

Thanks, Kipp. We reported GAAP net income per share of $0.89 for the Q3 of 2023 compared to $0.61 in the prior quarter and $0.21 in the Q3 of 2022. Our higher GAAP net income per share in the Q3 On a core basis, we reported core earnings per share of $0.59 for the Q3 of 2023 compared to $0.58 in the prior quarter and $0.50 in the Q3 of 2022. We continue to see the benefits of higher rates on our predominantly floating rate portfolio in the Q3 of 2023 as our interest and dividend income increased from both the prior quarter and the Q3 of the prior year. Our stockholders' equity ended the quarter at nearly $10,800,000,000 or $18.99 per share, which is an approximate 2% increase per share over the prior quarter.

Speaker 3

Our year to date annualized return on using GAAP EPS and core EPS was 14.5% 12.5%, respectively. This strong level of profitability further builds upon our long term track record of a 12% GAAP based annual return on NAV since inception. Our total portfolio at fair value at the end of the quarter was $21,900,000,000 up from $21,500,000,000 at the end of the second quarter, reflecting a combination of net fundings and net unrealized gains from the portfolio for the quarter. The weighted average yield on our debt and other income producing securities at amortized cost was 12.4% at September 30, 2023, which increased from 12.2% at June 30, 2023 10.7% at September 30, 2022. The weighted average yield on total investments and amortized cost was 11.2%, which increased from 11% June 30, 2023 9.6 percent at September 30, 2022.

Speaker 3

The yields on our portfolio largely reflect the continued increases in interest rates. Now let's shift to our capitalization and liquidity. During the quarter, we returned to the investment grade debt markets for the first time in over 18 months. This $600,000,000 debt issuance as it allowed us to slot into 2027 where we, after this issuance, still only have $1,100,000,000 maturing in that year. Overall, our liquidity position remains strong with approximately $5,300,000,000 of total available liquidity, Including available cash and we ended the 3rd quarter with a debt to equity ratio net of the available cash of 1.03x as compared to 1.07x a quarter ago.

Speaker 3

We believe our significant amount of dry powder and to have no refinancing risk with respect to next year's term debt maturities. We declared a 4th quarter 2023 Dividend of $0.48 per share. This dividend is payable on December 28, 2023 to stockholders of record on December 15, 20 23 and is consistent with our Q3 2023 dividend. As Kipp stated, we have a long standing dividend track record. We are one of the select few BDCs that have paid a stable or growing regular dividend over the past 14 plus years.

Speaker 3

And with that, I would like to turn the call over to Mitch to walk through our investment activities for the quarter.

Speaker 4

Thanks, Penny. I'm going to spend a few minutes providing more detail on our investment activity, our portfolio performance and our positioning for the Q3. I will then conclude with an update on our post quarter end activity, backlog and pipeline. In the 3rd quarter, We originated $1,600,000,000 of new investments, which increased from $1,200,000,000 in the prior quarter as we saw a slight uptick in M and A activity. Underscoring the breadth of our market coverage, the EBITDA in the companies we financed during the quarter range from below $20,000,000 to over $800,000,000 of EBITDA.

Speaker 4

Approximately 50% of our new commitments were to existing borrowers, which is consistent with our historical practice. With this quarter's activity, our portfolio now includes 490 companies. This is an increase from 3 54 companies pre COVID And represents a growth rate of 38%. I point this out to highlight the meaningful benefits that come from incumbency. We believe incumbency drives future origination.

Speaker 4

Additionally, we believe incumbency enables us to support our strongest Portfolio Companies reduces underwriting risk on new commitments and achieves better documentation and terms. And finally, incumbency enhances our relationship with financial sponsors. This quarter, over 85% of our sponsored transactions We're with repeat sponsors. Now, as we have all year, we continue to find compelling value in today's market. This is demonstrated by the 1st lien investments we originated in the quarter, which had a weighted average yield in excess of 12%, but a leverage ratio of only 4.6 times.

Speaker 4

This is a full turn of leverage lower than the industry senior leverage track by PitchBook LCD over the past 10 years. Underscoring Kit's earlier point about the historically attractive relative value we are able to achieve in the current market, the weighted average LTV Of all our new investments for this quarter was below 40%. In addition to adding accretive investments In the current market, our existing portfolio continues to perform well and we are seeing stability within our credit metrics. We believe this is largely due to our defensively positioned portfolio in market leading companies in resilient industries. In the Q3, the weighted average LPM EBITDA growth rate of our portfolio was a healthy 6%.

Speaker 4

This compares to an estimated flat EBITDA growth rate for the S and P 500 over the last 12 months. With respect to our portfolio grades, the weighted average Last quarter to 0.6% this quarter, which continues to be well below historical levels. Non accruals at cost decreased from 2.1% last to 1.2% this quarter and remain well below our 3% 15 year historical average and the KBW BDC average of 3.8% for the most recent 15 year period available. Looking forward, we remain confident about the performance of our portfolio in part due to our disciplined approach to risk management and portfolio diversification. Our $21,900,000,000 portfolio at fair value is diversified across This means that any single investment accounts for just 0.2% of the portfolio on average And our largest investment in any single company excluding SDLP and IBL is just 2% of the portfolio.

Speaker 4

We believe we have the greatest level of portfolio diversification of any publicly traded BDC. Finally, I will provide a brief Our post quarter end investment activity and pipeline. From October 1 through October 18, 2023, We made new investment commitments totaling $410,000,000 of which $297,000,000 were funded. We exited Or were repaid on $158,000,000 of investment commitments. As of October 18, our backlog and pipeline stood at roughly 820,000,000 Our backlog and pipeline contains certain investments that are subject to approvals and documentation and may not close or we may sell a portion of these investments post closing.

Speaker 4

I will now turn the call back over to Kipp for some closing remarks.

Speaker 2

Thanks, Mitch. In closing, we're pleased with the quarter. Our portfolio continues to perform well and our sourcing, underwriting, Portfolio management and capital advantages are driving strong financial results. We feel that we're well positioned to navigate any potential future economic challenges and to capitalize on today's attractive environment for new investing. As always, we appreciate you joining our call today and we'd be happy to open the line for questions.

Speaker 2

Operator?

Operator

Thank Please note as a courtesy to those who may wish to ask a question The Investor Relations team will be available to address any further questions at the conclusion of today's call. Our first question comes from Melissa Wedel with JPMorgan. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 5

Good morning. Thanks for taking my questions today. Hi, Tim, I wanted to start with some of the commentary you provided around expecting some rebounded activity in 2024. It sounds like some of that is based on Dry powder and expected pressure from private equity investors to reengage a little bit. But do you think there's risk to that recovery and Should rates remain even higher than expected as implied by the forward curve right now?

Speaker 2

I mean, it's probably just thanks for the question, Melissa. It's probably just my own view. But I mean, I think this has been a difficult year to buy and sell things, as I've said in some other Places, if you haven't been in a need to sell mode, this is probably a pretty difficult year to think about selling. And then buyers obviously are exploring, we think, materially lower purchase prices for a lot of assets, not just corporates. And I think that Translate similarly into real estate and infrastructure assets, etcetera.

Speaker 2

Everything's just worth less in a higher rate environment. My optimism around next year is that if we see a leveling out of rates, which I think we're Seeing generally, maybe there's another increase or 2, but generally, you're seeing a leveling of rates, that price exploration that's been Going on between buyers and sellers just gets to be a bit easier, right? But while you're seeing rates, I think unexpectedly Increase as quickly as they did and as materially as they did, it just makes those conversations more difficult. So that's kind of number 1. And number 2, yes, My belief is that there are a lot of limited partners out there that have money in the ground, particularly in private equity, where They're looking to 2024 as a year where they need more material repayments to come back, right, when they think about managing their cash flows, whether it's a pension Or any other investor.

Speaker 2

So I'm hopeful that the combination of those two things should lead to better activity levels. I think our Deal flow today, Mitch talked a little bit about the backlog and pipeline is better than it's been. So I'm cautiously optimistic, but I guess we'll wait and see.

Speaker 5

That's really helpful. Thanks, Kit. And then a question for Penny. Penny, did you have an update for us on any spillover income

Speaker 3

As of quarter end? Thanks so much. Thanks for the question. We have been continuing to accrue Well, I may go back to we did finalize last year's tax return and the final spillover was About $1.18 per share or $643,000,000 as we finalize that number and that's what's reflected in the earnings presentation. As we look into 2023, we continue to accrue excise tax to come to a similar level of spillover to last year.

Speaker 3

We're still obviously going through the year and tax is never done until we get through a full year, but we are continuing to Accrue excise tax at a similar level, if you annualize where we are this year to date versus the final expense for last year.

Speaker 5

Thanks, Penny.

Operator

Our next question is from Finian O'Shea with Wells Fargo. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 6

Hi, everyone. Sorry, I was on mute. On the repeat borrower financing Statistic you gave 50% this quarter, which is helpful that you give that. That appears to have come down from pretty elevated levels In the first half, so I'm seeing if there's anything to see there in terms of a completion, say, of Refinancings of your portfolio companies, or maybe some of the exits are rolling off out into the market. I'll stop there.

Speaker 6

And or I guess if you can add as well, year to date, what percent of your directionally Of your commitments to repeat borrowers are for refis versus M and A? Thank you.

Speaker 7

Yes. Hey, Fin. It's Kare Schnabel. I think on the first part of the question around the 50% Existing borrowers, that's actually consistent with our historical experience if you look back over in a normal period 50% to existing borrowers. So I think what you're just seeing is a pickup in activity for new borrowers Relative to the prior few quarters where obviously that volume was a little more muted and that's what resulted in us Returning to that 50% level to existing borrowers.

Speaker 7

So I don't think there's anything more to see there other than that. And then on the second part of the question, actually, I'm sorry, I don't

Speaker 2

No. Was there a change in use of proceeds? I don't actually think then we have kind of that And now let's just run. Frankly, we can go back and dig a little bit in the numbers, but let us go take a look at that and we'll come back to you offline.

Speaker 6

Okay. Thank you. And a follow-up on Ivy Hill. Do you have a breakdown of, Say the weighted average duration for the CLO reinvestment periods, are those materially shortening like As we're seeing in the BSL CLO market? Thank you.

Speaker 2

Yes. No, not really. I mean, we continue to actually be able to raise capital there. I could go back and dig with the team and look at it, but it's not something I spend a lot of time thinking about. It's pretty diversified.

Speaker 2

It's a combination of loan mandates and CLOs, but Mitch is Mitch, I would say not all CLOs

Speaker 4

and ideals anyway, right? There's a lot of bespoke, they call it loan mandate, Bank loans where we are able to adjust those maturities year after year and have a consistent basis within IBL. There's not a shortening of that and we've been having lots of success refinancing when we needed to, but then not all CLOs is the important point.

Speaker 6

Thanks so much.

Speaker 2

Yes, thanks.

Operator

Our next question comes from Arren Cyganovich with Citi. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 8

Thanks. With 2024 looking like it might be a better year for There are at least an increase in activity for investing. Are you expecting exits to be of a similar amount? And what are you thinking about in terms Potentially increasing some of the leverage you have in the portfolio?

Speaker 2

Yes. I mean, they tend to be reasonably reciprocal, Aaron. Thanks question. I would think that new deal activity and repayments are likely to pick up next year relative to this year, which has been slower on all those fronts.

Speaker 8

Okay. And it was good to see your non accrual activity ratios came down What's your outlook for next year for expectations with non accruals? I would imagine the industry is expected See a bit of an increase from here.

Speaker 2

Yes, I think you're probably right. I mean, our this quarter where we actually realized a Couple of restructurings and situations where we took ownership of a company where we continue to be a lender, we actually exited 2 situations That we were not feeling great about and realized 2 charge offs, but charge offs sort of At the mark. So I think we carried them well. Yes, I think you're probably right. I mean with higher rates Being in place now for a while and the general slowdown in the economy, that would tell you that the general expectation, I think, not just at this I think not just at this company, but most of our competitors in the market broadly as the defaults will continue to go up next year.

Operator

Our next question comes from Casey Alexander with Compass Blank, please proceed with your question.

Speaker 9

Hi, good afternoon.

Speaker 10

Hi, Steve.

Speaker 2

Kind of a

Speaker 9

Kind of a cross purposes question, but noticing that you swapped out the new debt maturity Into a floater, sort of feels like a call that it's your expectation that rates will Come down and that your cost on that will get cheaper, otherwise not sure why you would swap it out. But Suggesting that 2024 is a better year for deals and originations actually argues That you think that the economy is going to be okay and deal activity is going to pick up and that kind of argues that rates Stay higher for longer. I'm curious at sort of the crosscurrents from those two items.

Speaker 2

I'm going to turn to Penny on the hedging comment because we had quite a lot of debate about that. It was atypical From our past practice. But Penny, do you want to jump into some thinking there maybe and then we can come back and talk about views on 24 and how we see things and Casey, your guess is as good as mine around rates, but I'll let Penny comment on the hedging arrangement.

Speaker 3

Yes. And Obviously, none of us have the perfect crystal ball on rates. But in this case, we did a shorter duration 3.5 year term loan. And it is atypical, as Kipp said, for us to swap. Historically, we've tended to just stick with whatever the base rate is on the liability that we've issued.

Speaker 3

In this case, with a view towards the forward curve and a matching looking at our portfolio being predominantly floating rate assets, It felt like a good opportunity to swap that with the expectation, at least at the time we did it, that rates would come down even if We knew they would stay a little bit higher for longer based on the forward curve.

Speaker 2

Yes, I think that's right. I mean, I think we're operating today, Casey, with the I believe, and everybody has a pretty different view on this even here these days, that The base rate is going to be higher for longer. I would agree with your commentary that the U. S. Economy seems, while it's slowing, To be pretty okay.

Speaker 2

I mean, I don't think it's great, but I think it's pretty okay. And when you think about our Which I think is more defensively positioned and as we always mention, less oriented towards cyclical companies, we're seeing, As we reported, EBITDA growth in the portfolio, while slowing substantially better than the economy. So we're pretty constructive around the economy. We think that will keep rates higher for longer to your point. And I think I'd also just point out maybe to finish, It's unusual that the Fed is really in the market in a material way during a Presidential election and we happen to have one of those coming up next year.

Speaker 2

So I would expect a less active Fed next year, which would imply Higher for longer and that's what we're managing to.

Speaker 9

Okay. Thank you for that. My follow-up is that your rate of non accruals Is terrifically low. I don't know a better adjective to use for it. To what extent Did your companies actually benefit from recasting their expense basis because of the COVID Crisis.

Speaker 9

And how much are they benefiting from the slow nature of this moving economy that's allowing them to adjust along the way And that's benefiting your portfolio with a lower level of non accruals than you might have expected?

Speaker 2

I I think it's a little bit of all of that. We did make that point coming out of the really the most difficult period of the pandemic because it obviously forced companies to Really evaluate where they were from a cost perspective. That will happen when you have no revenue, right, in your quote. So I do think there's some of that. But look for credit investors and we've been saying this publicly, we think this It's a reasonably good environment, right?

Speaker 2

We've set up our portfolios. We don't need to see a tremendous amount of growth in the portfolio, Where we have high free cash flow companies maybe not deleveraging as quickly as they might have hoped with a lower base rate, but still able to deleverage. I think this environment is a trickier one for some of the embedded equity that got put in the ground, particularly in private equity from, call it, 2019 to '22 where prices were much higher, rates were much lower and expectations for growth were there. A lot of those things have been You have changed, right? So we're feeling again pretty good.

Speaker 2

We appreciate the terrifically good Commentary. But no, we're happy with where the portfolio is at. We think it's very manageable for us going forward. And we're just locked Making sure that we're early on problem companies and doing what we've done a long time here. So we feel Pretty good about how the company is positioned as I mentioned in the prepared remarks.

Speaker 11

All right.

Speaker 2

Thank you. Sure. Thanks for the questions.

Operator

Our next question comes from Bylus Abraham with UBS. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 10

Hey, everyone. Thanks for the question. Can you comment a little bit on the industry mix and the backlog? Looks like a good chunk of it is consumer. And then just maybe more broadly, are you seeing any meaningful divergence in EBITDA trends across industries?

Speaker 10

Thank you.

Speaker 2

Yes. I mean, it's such a short period of time in the backlog. I can Penny is pulling it up. It probably represents just a handful of transactions and one that happens to be large in the consumer space. So I wouldn't draw a whole lot from frankly that small sample set.

Speaker 2

The origination Sort of opportunities are similar now as to how they have been all year and in the past. How we're seeing the mix of The economy and what's creating watch list items is the same. For the most part, it tends to be some Elements in our healthcare portfolio as we and others have talked about in past quarters where some of the practice based and service based Healthcare companies haven't been able to raise price as much as some others and have had labor issues and shortage issues there. We've had some of the same concerns. And then I think a certain portion of the portfolio, as I always describe it, is companies that make things, right, that do have good pricing power, had the ability to put through quite a lot of price increases, but all of a sudden they may have run out of gas on their ability to continue to raise prices on Certain items, starting to see a little bit more margin pressure.

Speaker 2

But more often than not, when you look at our 1s and 2s, which are Kind of our watch list name, it's only about 7% of the portfolio and it's pretty diverse. There's not a lot of common underpinning there. It's more company specific than anything else.

Speaker 10

Got it. That's helpful. And

Speaker 9

on leverage, it sounds like

Speaker 10

the message there is On balance sheet leverage that you're kind of comfortable in this zip code here, right around oneone for the Foreseeable future, is that a fair characterization? And are there any conditions you think in the near or medium term They could change that one way or the other?

Speaker 2

Yes. No, I mean, I think it's at the lower end of our target range. But as you know, it kind of Comes and goes quarter to quarter depending on the activity. I think we feel Comfortable being at the lower end because obviously, the earnings are so good at the company that being more levered doesn't really create a Material earnings benefit from here. We actually value having access to the dry powder, Thinking about both the new investing environment as well as opportunities in the existing portfolio.

Speaker 10

Great. Thank you.

Speaker 2

You're welcome.

Operator

Our next question is from Robert Dodd with Raymond James. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 12

Hi. And yes, congratulations on the quarter and the credit quality. On this if you're going back to the couple of Casey's questions, okay, on the swap question, Should we view this as kind of a one time event just taking opportunity or more of a near term strategy? Obviously, you've got couple of maturities in 2024, couple more in 2025. Should I be assuming that you're likely to swap those as well or If you replace them with like for like kind of structures or was it really a one off thing?

Speaker 3

Yes, thanks for the question. Honestly, it's hard to say. This is something we assess on a deal by deal basis. And as I said before, it's rare that we actually do this. We just thought this was an interesting opportunity in the current market.

Speaker 3

So we would look to Make this assessment upon each issuance as we go into 2024. We have $1,100,000,000 of maturities That are effectively resolved at this point. And so we will kind of continue to assess when it's Appropriate and good for us to go to the market, but when we do that, we will make the assessment on swapping at that time.

Speaker 4

Got it.

Speaker 12

Thank you. And then the second one, talking about atypical things, I mean, you're not accruals are very, very low. If I look at new defaults, anything like that, any kind of credit metric is very, very good. Can you give us any kind of I mean, is that entirely The result of portfolio company performance or has there been any atypical behavior from sponsors maybe putting More equity when it's not actually required again, I wouldn't necessarily expect that, but the credit quality of the loans is Yes. Helgan, the market will be well.

Speaker 12

So any color on is there anything unusual about that or is it just Hopefully, the company performance?

Speaker 2

No, I don't think there's anything unusual at all. I mean, we mentioned in the prepared remarks that to the extent we've actually Look to some of the private equity partners we've had a long time to support companies with capital they have. But more than anything to your question, I think we're actually seeing pretty good underlying performance in the portfolio companies. It's better That I would have expected if you asked me a year ago, which is why we're optimistic for 2024 and beyond. And I do expect some companies will perhaps have some problem as the clock ticks along, but and that's my expectation for Modestly higher defaults, but we're feeling pretty constructive on where we are in terms of the economy and the portfolio.

Speaker 12

Thank you.

Speaker 2

Thanks for the questions.

Operator

Our next question comes from Keith Kenneth Lee with RBC Capital Markets. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 11

Hi, thanks for taking my question. Wondering if you could just talk about any kind of outlook in terms of opportunities around being able to partner with banks or Any opportunities related to the change in regulatory framework on the bank side there? Thanks.

Speaker 2

Sure. I mean, I'll go maybe up a level and just say In terms of Ares management and our credit platform here, we see extraordinary opportunity to potentially partner with the banks. We bought a sizable portfolio as folks had seen from a bank this year and the dialogue around the banks And some of their concerns relative to their balance sheets and their capacity continues to drive a lot of really interesting conversations With those counterparties, but to come back into this company specifically, Well, I think that Ares Capital Corporation can potentially participate in those opportunities. I think there are other parts of the credit platform that are frankly More engaged in those discussions because as you know, most banks, which is obviously why our companies Had so much success and it's gotten so large, really don't engage in middle market corporate lending anymore. So our expectation that they'd be selling the types of loans that this company would want to buy seems to me at least to be pretty low.

Speaker 2

Most of the assets that we think will eventually be discussed and potentially for sale from some of the banks probably Are a little bit outside of the mandate of this company, but I can tell you that as a platform, those discussions are very vibrant and I would expect them to be ongoing for a while.

Speaker 11

Got you. Very helpful there. And then one final follow-up question. This is actually Just a follow-up on Robert's question previously. In terms of the portfolio support you're seeing, Wondered if you could just provide a little bit more color around there in terms of I think in your prepared remarks, you said You were relatively pleased with what you're seeing.

Speaker 11

I wonder if you could just expand upon that. Thanks.

Speaker 2

I'm sorry. I missed that there for a second. Can you comment on that one, please?

Speaker 11

Yes. Just in terms of the Portfolio support you're seeing from the PE sponsors, in the prepared remarks, you mentioned you're Really pleased with what you're seeing so far. Wondering if you could just provide a little bit more color or expand upon those remarks there. Thanks.

Speaker 2

I think we're pleased with the support that we've seen from the private equity community. I don't really know what else to say. I mean, when asked, in situations where it's required, we've seen Partners in private equity companies and obviously feel good about their continued ownership in those companies. I mean the good news here is We as a team have been doing this with a lot of the same private equity firms for a long time. It's very common that we have Several, if not more than several investments with a single private equity firm.

Speaker 2

So that relationship and that trust has been built over time and we've just Great partnership from that community as they try to figure things out. And as I mentioned, I think it's a more challenging environment to be an Owner of assets today than it is to be a lender to those assets, because when problems occur, The dialogue tends to be one of us turning to ownership and saying what's the plan and very often the plan is Equity support is required and we've seen it follow on pretty well.

Speaker 4

Yes. The benefit also of being levered 40% or 30% to 40% loan to value provides lot of cushion such that in a slower environment, the actual owners are, As you can see, willing to put money in because they need to. And we've been the beneficiaries of being where we sit in the cap structure.

Speaker 2

Yes.

Speaker 10

I mean,

Speaker 2

I think it's they need to, but they also, are doing it economically, right? They're looking at investments that they've made And what are good companies that they want to support and own. And while maybe the duration of their investment is going to extend a little bit And perhaps the return on that investment has to come down over time with higher rates. They're are supporting these companies because they view that follow on support as a good investment, right? One that's going to generate a return for their investors.

Speaker 2

And that gives us a lot of confidence that we have strong partners, and that we're invested in good companies.

Speaker 11

Got you. Very helpful there. Thanks again.

Speaker 2

Sure. Yes, you're welcome. Sorry, I missed that the first time around.

Operator

Our next question comes from Mark Hughes with Truist Securities. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 13

Yes, thanks. Good morning, good afternoon. If you mentioned the leverage finance market, it's less constructive, the new transactions you pointed out How the $1,000,000,000 plus unitranche was becoming more prevalent. Was that a function of this broader transition to private credit or was that maybe influenced by some of the Volatility later in the market that or later in the quarter that you mentioned around, higher for longer and political Certainty?

Speaker 2

Yes. I mean, I'm going to let Cord jump in too, if you'd like. I'd say to answer your question simply, it's both, Right. So I think over a long period of time, the private credit marketplace has been demonstrating To counter parties that it has a very attractive solution for borrowers and owners that It can get achieved particularly in scale these days away from the public markets. So More and more adoption, more and more recognition from our counterparties that the products that we're providing, again, scaled, Flexible, customized, etcetera to each solution are actually really attractive and support their Investment thesis on the equity side, that of course accelerates during periods of higher market volatility.

Speaker 2

So Over the last few quarters, it's probably both. But I think the long term arrow is very much to your question pointing towards Higher and higher percentage of deals getting done with private capital and it seems to me the numbers support fewer deals, particularly smaller, $1,200,000,000 and under getting done away from the syndicated markets.

Speaker 7

Yes. I think our primary Competitive advantage is certainty over the banks, which often they provide less certainty. So in periods of volatility, we're going to win with that advantage. But then when banks will step back into the market In less volatile times, people remember that volatility can come again and that certainty is valuable and so that just creates permanent Market share shifts, and it's not linear over time, but that as Kipp said, that trend toward that permanent shift, We believe we'll continue.

Speaker 13

Understood. And I'll kind of approach the credit question maybe a little different way. Do you get the sense to anybody is the portfolio companies are, say, foregoing CapEx or hiring, If we're going to be higher for longer in terms of interest rates, are they keeping ahead of the game in terms of the good Growth you've described or I think you might have said it, 2024, the outlook is for a little more pressure on Credit, just the passage of time. If interest rates don't decline, will that passage of time just put the Natural pressure on credit.

Speaker 2

Yes. I mean to answer the first part of your question, which I think is the most interesting question, that's sort of what we're all watching and talking to our companies about, Right. Because the reality is we're sitting in an environment where you're actually seeing pretty good economic performance again across the portfolio, reasonable growth even if it's Slowing, but all of a sudden companies that are achieving plan or close to achieving plan, have a lot less cash flow around than they had, Right. So servicing debt, something that they obviously need to put the utmost focus on. Is that changing the way they run their business?

Speaker 2

Are they making It's a great question. It's like the question that we're talking to all of our companies about, to understand that. But I think that's The answer to that question, which I don't have today, will dictate sort of where the economy goes in 2024 and beyond.

Operator

Our next question comes from Ryan Lynch with KBW. Please proceed with your question.

Speaker 11

Hey, good

Speaker 14

afternoon. My first question was just on the broadly syndicated loan markets We're pretty weak at the end of 2022 and as well as the beginning of 2023. But in the Previous in this Q3, you started to see a lot more activity coming back to the broadly syndicated loan market. Again, still relatively low relative to what private credit and direct lenders are doing. I'm just curious with the most recent volatility, Is this broadly syndicated loan market still an option for borrowers out there or did that take a pretty big step back from the sort of momentum it started to get in the Q3?

Speaker 2

Yes. I mean, so trying to come back, right, needs the CLO Machine to function again, obviously, and that's the largest buyer in the space. And I think the banks today are structuring to ratings, frankly, to achieve ratings and larger deals, they feel confident they can syndicate. So to the extent it fits that profile, very much an option. To the extent it doesn't fit that profile, It kind of comes to us and others.

Speaker 14

Okay. So it just goes back to your comment of kind of the larger deals still having that option, larger high quality deals, but some of the smaller

Speaker 2

Yes, yes. Multi $1,000,000,000 term loans that get a B2 rating, the market's open, other stuff, not so much.

Speaker 14

Okay. And then the other question is for you, Penny. I know you talked about the most recent bond offering and swapping that rate out. And one of the questions I just had with that is, versus the swap or not swap that out, I understand the commentary on that. But Was there any consideration for instead of doing an additional unsecured bond, just drawing down on the credit facility?

Speaker 14

You would have a better spread, you would reduce some commitment fees, you still have that optionality where if rates do go lower, You would actually have a lower overall yield on that debt as well as you guys have over 70% unsecured Debt on your liability structure. So it's not like you guys have a big need for further unsecuring your a liability structure. So I was just wanting to know how is the decision from swapping out unsecured debt versus just drawing on the credit facility made?

Speaker 3

No, I think it's a great question. As you can see from our capital structure, we have raised a lot of secured debt through revolving credit facilities and have We like to look at all of the capital markets in which we go to market for the liability structure and We care about the latter and the maturities and the access to capital from multiple sources. And we are looking forward to debt maturities over the next 1, 2, 3 years. So we felt like it made sense to go tap back into the investment grade market as one of those Many sources of capital that we have. If you look at where we swapped it to, while higher than most of our Credit facilities, it is still lower than our highest priced credit facility by a little bit.

Speaker 3

So it's in line with the revolvers. And by swapping, it does give us the opportunity to ride rates down if you believe the curve when that happens over the 3.5 year tenure. So A lot of this is about continuing to build an appropriate capital structure and also think about the latter maturities. We did have a window in 2027 without much maturing on a relative basis and even with this issuance, it's still $1,100,000,000 And the term debt market in 'twenty seven. So it just helps us continue to build out that ladder and access multiple sources of capital.

Speaker 3

We'll continue to look to both Marcus, but I also think our team has done a great job of continuing to get more capital in on the secured I'm sorry, floating rate side, but it takes really all components to make the balance sheet work.

Speaker 14

Okay. I understand there's a lot of dynamics that go into this. That's all from me. I appreciate your time today.

Speaker 2

Thanks, Brian.

Operator

This concludes our question and answer session. I'd like to turn the conference back over to Mr. Kipp Dever for any closing remarks.

Speaker 2

As usual, I don't have any other than to say thanks for taking the time to join the call and Appreciate the good questions and hope everybody has a great day, great week.

Operator

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes our conference Call for today, if you missed any part

Speaker 5

of today's

Operator

call, an archived replay of the call will be available approximately 1 hour after the end of the call through November 21 at 5 pm Eastern to domestic callers by dialing 877-660-6853 Enter international callers by dialing 1-two zero one-six twelve-seven fourteen. For all replays, please reference conference number 1,000,000,00714. An archived replay will be also available on the webcast link located on the homepage of the Investor Sources section of ARRIS Capital's website. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

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Earnings Conference Call
Ares Capital Q3 2023
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