InterDigital Q3 2023 Earnings Call Transcript

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Provided by Quartr
November 2, 2023

Key Takeaways

  • InterDigital reported Q3 revenue of $140 million, up 22% YoY, with smartphone licensing +19% and CE/IoT licensing +30%; net income was $48 million (+116%) and adjusted EBITDA was $84 million (+48%).
  • The company signed a multiyear HEVC license with Lenovo covering smartphones and PCs, a Q Max deal for set-top boxes, and joined the Avanci 5G automobile pool licensing Mercedes-Benz and BMW at roughly 2× the original 4G royalty rates.
  • InterDigital’s patent portfolio now exceeds 30,000 granted and pending patents with record invention filings, was ranked among the top five global 5G portfolios by LexisNexis, and holds key leadership positions in 3GPP standard bodies.
  • Q3 free cash flow and operating cash flow each surpassed $300 million; the company raised its dividend by 14%, repurchased about 1 million shares (~$79 million) in Q3/October, and has returned $360 million to shareholders YTD ($1.5 billion over ten years).
  • For Q4, management guides to recurring revenue of ~$104 million, operating expenses of ~$78 million (implying ~49% adjusted EBITDA margin) and GAAP EPS of $0.70–0.80, while targeting a long-term 60% EBITDA margin on $650 million of annual recurring device licensing revenue.
AI Generated. May Contain Errors.
Earnings Conference Call
InterDigital Q3 2023
00:00 / 00:00

There are 9 speakers on the call.

Operator

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the InterDigital Third Quarter 2023 Earnings Call. At this time, all participants are in a listen only mode. After the speakers' presentation, there will be a question and answer Advising your hand is raised. Please be advised that today's Conference is being recorded.

Operator

I would now like to hand the conference over to your speaker today, Raiford Garabrett. Please go ahead.

Speaker 1

Good morning to everyone and welcome to InterDigital's Q3 2023 earnings conference call. I am Raeford Garabrant, Head of Investor Relations for InterDigital. With me on today's call are Liren Chin, our President and CEO and Rich Brezke, our CFO. Consistent with last quarter's call, we will offer some highlights about this quarter and the company and then open the call up for questions. Before we begin our remarks, I need to remind you that in this call, we will make forward looking statements regarding our current beliefs, Plans and expectations, which are not guarantees of future performance and are made only as of the date hereof.

Speaker 1

Forward looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results and events to differ materially from results and events contemplated by such forward looking statements. These risks and uncertainties include those described in the Risk Factors Sections of our 2022 Annual Report on Form 10 ks and in our other SEC filings. In addition, today's presentation may contain references to non GAAP financial measures. Reconciliations of these non GAAP financial measures To the most directly comparable GAAP financial measures are included in our financial metrics tracker, which is available on the Investor Relations section of our website. With that taken care of, I will turn the call over to Liran.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Rifert, and good morning, everyone. Thanks for joining us today. This was another very strong quarter for our company, supported by outstanding execution across all aspects of our business. We have signed 2 new license agreements that build on our strong base of recurring revenue, expanded our industry leadership, Had record setting pace from our inventors in expanding our innovation pipeline and receive acknowledgment of our 5 gs patent portfolio leadership by a leading third party report. I'll start with a few highlights from our financial result.

Speaker 2

Revenue for the quarter was $140,000,000 up 22% year over year. Our smartphone licensing revenue was up 19% year over year and our CE and IoT licensing revenue was up 30% year over year. Our net income was almost $48,000,000 up 116% year over year. Our adjusted EBITDA was about $84,000,000 an increase of 48% year over year. I'll let Rich discuss more details in his section.

Speaker 2

These strong financial results demonstrate the continued momentum we have created to grow our smartphone licensing program and our CEM IoT program and demonstrate how our technologies are more important than ever to a growing number of increasingly connected industries. In late September, we signed a new multiyear royalty bearing license with Lenovo, covering our HEVC video compression technology. Lenovo incorporates HEVC video compression in both smartphones and consumer electronic devices such as PCs. Under this new agreement, we received a A cash out payment for the past use of our technologies and recurring revenue going forward for both our smartphone licensing and our CE and IoT licensing programs. The latest agreement has brought our related HEVC litigation with Lenovo to an end, And we remain committed to resolve the rest of our licensing disputes with them.

Speaker 2

Staying on the licensing front, in Q3, we also signed a new license agreement with Q Max to cover the company's set top boxes. Together with the Lenovo HEVC agreement, this is another validation of our video portfolio as one of the largest And one of the highest quality in key technologies such as HEVC as well as the newer VVC video codec. These technologies are applicable to smartphones, CE and other IoT devices and looking forward to what we see as our large greenfield opportunity to license video streaming and cloud services. Adding to our momentum, we recently became a founding member of Avanti 5 gs Automobile Patent Licensing Platform As we look to build up the success of related 4 gs patent pool, in the 3rd quarter, The platform licensed both Mercedes Benz and BMW for 5 gs. Due to the increased value of 5 gs to automobile manufacturers, The 5 gs royalty rates are roughly twice the original 4 gs rates.

Speaker 2

We believe our revenue from the connected cards will grow with increasing 5 gs adoption over time. We continue to make strong progress with our smartphone program. In our Samsung arbitration, Based on the latest case schedule, the hearing date is set for summer of next year and we are on track to receive a final determination towards the end of 2024. As a reminder, Samsung has already agreed To take a license to our portfolio starting January 1, 2023, with the final terms of the license due to be determined through arbitration. So as we have said many times before, The most valuable assets for our company are our people.

Speaker 2

We have some of the world's best innovators in the development of key wireless and video standards and other technologies. Recently, our leadership in cellular space was highlighted by the election of our senior wireless standard engineer, Diana Penney to chair the RAN2 working group within 3 gsPP, the cellular wired standard body responsible for 5 gs and future 6 gs development. The RAN2 Chair is one of the most critical leadership positions in 3DPP. In her election, Diana received broad support from more than 200 companies across the industry, Underlying InterDigital's status was a strong leader in cellular technologies. We also take great pride that Diana is the 1st woman to be elected To the post, as a critical point in 5 gs evolution with the introduction of 5 gs Advanced.

Speaker 2

Her role within 3GPP is one of more than 100 leadership positions that our engineers hold across multiple standard development automation for wireless and video technologies. In Q3, We also achieved an important milestone with our patent portfolio now exceeding 30,000 grantee patents and pending applications. It was also our highest quarter ever for new invention filings and we are on track for a record year for new invention creation. The strength of our portfolio was recently confirmed by a new analysis from LexisNexis. This analysis, which measures both the quality and the quantity of 5 gs portfolios from more than 130 companies, Recognize this interdigital as having one of the top 5 gs patent portfolios in the world, ranking us ahead of multiple well known innovators in the cellular space.

Speaker 2

This confirms our belief that we are in an excellent position To realizing further value from our cellular assets at a time when we believe 5 gsAdvance will drive new use cases for our innovation. Recently, we have announced partnership with university in India and Spain to explore research in technologies that could enable future 6 gs wireless network. This is another example of the kind of early stage research we do and our efforts to enable broader ecosystem in the wireless space. As I look at our portfolio And our innovation pipeline in the wireless space, we are ideally positioned between our ongoing focus on 5 gs and our long term research in fundamental technology for 6 gs and beyond. In summary, we delivered excellent performance across our business In the Q3 and continue to build momentum to position the business for long term growth.

Speaker 2

With that, I'll hand you over to Rich to talk through the numbers in more detail.

Speaker 3

Thanks, Laren. I'm excited to report that in Q3, We delivered another excellent performance with revenue, diluted earnings per share and adjusted EBITDA that were off well above the high end of our guidance range. This is primarily the result of the largest Standalone HEVC license we've ever signed, which drove upside to both recurring and catch up revenue. These results support our long term objective of delivering consistent revenue growth combined with strong margins. Total revenue increased 22% year over year, highlighted by continued double digit growth and recurring revenue for CE and IoT.

Speaker 3

Year to date, recurring revenue for CE and IoT is up 17% and demonstrates the multiple growth vectors of our business. As Liran mentioned, the HEVC license covers both smartphones and PCs. We have recognized $145,000,000 of revenue from Lenovo over the 1st 3 quarters of this year with over $40,000,000 coming in Q3, including a significant catch up for prior infringement. The recurring contribution from Lenovo pushed our Q3 annualized recurring revenue from CE and IoT to $62,000,000 per year. As Liran mentioned, this license demonstrates The quality of our HEVC video compression technology, its relevance for devices beyond smartphones And looking forward highlights what we believe is a greenfield opportunity to license video streaming and cloud services.

Speaker 3

Cash flow was extremely strong in Q3 with cash flow from operations and free cash flow both in excess of $300,000,000 As we've noted in the past, due to the timing of customer payments, our free cash flow can fluctuate quarter to quarter, which is why we also published adjusted EBITDA. Our adjusted EBITDA for the quarter of $83,000,000 increased 48% year over year, while our adjusted EBITDA margin increased 11 points year over year to 60%, in line with our long term goal. We continue to return cash to shareholders in Q3, first by increasing our regular dividend by 14% and second, by repurchasing almost 700,000 shares for $57,000,000 in the quarter, plus another 300,000 shares for $22,000,000 in the month of October. That brings our year to date return of capital through October 31 to over $360,000,000 including a reduction of almost 13% of the outstanding shares from beginning of this year. Over the past decade, we've been responsible stewards by returning over $1,500,000,000 in cash to shareholders.

Speaker 3

Looking forward to Q4, I'll remind you that our Q4 revenue guidance is based off of contracts signed to date since the timing of license agreements is inherently uncertain. On that basis, we expect Q4 recurring revenues will be around $104,000,000 With operating expenses of about $78,000,000 driving an adjusted EBITDA margin of about 49%. Furthermore, we expect to continue to repurchase stock and finally, we expect GAAP diluted earnings per share of $0.70 to $0.80 Longer term, our goal remains to achieve and sustain a 60% adjusted EBITDA margin on 650 $1,000,000 of annual recurring revenue from device licenses with additional upside from licensing new products and services. With that, I'll turn it back to Raeford.

Speaker 1

Thanks, Rich. At this point, operator, we are ready to take questions.

Operator

Thank you. And for your first question, it comes from the line of Scott Searle from ROTH MKM. Scott, your line is open. Please ask your question.

Speaker 4

Hey, good morning. Thanks for taking my questions guys. Hey, nice job on the quarter. Rich, quickly, I'm not sure if I heard a mix between fixed fee and royalty on the recurring side. I'd love to have a little bit of visibility there.

Speaker 4

I wanted to clarify, Lenovo now everything has been settled, Liren. I know there were some outstanding issues and concerns related to Ongoing royalty rates in smartphones, but it sounds like that's been wrapped up now with the HEVC, latest agreement with them on that front. Also to clarify as well on the Samsung front for arbitration, while the timeline for final determination sounds like it's the end of next year, I'm interpreting this that there are no issues in terms of the baseline amount of ongoing payments that you would receive, which was consistent with The prior agreement, is that correct?

Speaker 3

Yes. So Scott, let me start On your first question, you asked about fixed fee revenue and we do disclose in our metrics, I'll remind you that and I'll tell you what the figure is For Q3, fixed fee revenue as a percentage of recurring revenue is 88%.

Speaker 2

Perfect. Yes. Hey, Scott, this is Leron. Let me take on the Lenovo question. And so new deal we have announced today is covering the HEVC technology that's applied to both our PC and their smartphone.

Speaker 2

As you remember, we have the core decision from U. K. Core covering the cellular technology, that's 3 gs, 4 gs and 5 gs. That agreement, as by the court decision, goes until end of this year, December 31, 2023. In the meantime, we are also pursuing values that they have benefited from other technologies in our portfolio, such as Wi Fi patterns as well as valuable implementation pattern technology.

Speaker 2

So those are Part of the moving parts, but we are really pleased by the new deal we have signed with them. So on the Samsung arbitration, what we have disclosed Pierre, frankly, we touched on this issue in the last earnings call. So we have the 3 panel arbitrators already assembled and they had their case Management meeting. So therefore, the hearing has already been set for summer of next year 2024 And both parties will be working producing quite a few document to the panel arbitrators and they will consider. So after the hearing, we do That's a decision before end of next year.

Speaker 2

So we are absolutely on pace and I'll let Rich comment on the revenue recognition just a little bit.

Speaker 3

And I'm sorry, Scott, could you just repeat that the last part of your question on the rev rec?

Speaker 4

No, I think you answered all three parts of that. Then I had Maybe the follow-up and then I'll get back in the queue. It looks like CE starting to accelerate. You had good results this quarter. You've been continuing to build some momentum.

Speaker 4

And Laren, I wonder if you could qualitatively talk about how that pipeline is ramping up. I know you've talked about a bigger number Of where Technicolor was bought, that was $150,000,000 or so. We're now at a $60 plus 1,000,000 run rate. Is this the point where we start to see that Accelerating. And also a clarification on the streaming opportunity for you guys using your HEVC patents and otherwise On the video services model, I'm not sure if you made any comments on that earlier.

Speaker 4

I thought one of the license agreements referred to cloud. And I'm not sure If you're referring kind of indirectly to that opportunity in licensing agreement or opportunity going forward with Streaming providers or if you could provide some color and timeline related to that?

Speaker 2

Thanks. Yes. Hey, Scott, let me take the question here. So we agree with your assessment that our momentum is accelerating in the CE and other devices. As of now, we remain committed to the overall $150,000,000 recurring revenue for the CE and IoT opportunity.

Speaker 2

But also additional, we will be recognizing on case by case cash out payment as we have in the Lenovo case here. So that will be on top of the $150,000,000 recurring revenue. Regarding my earlier comments, make sure that we have signed 2 new deals in this quarter. 1 is for the HEVC deal for Lenovo, the other one It's a HUMAX deal that's covering set top boxes. So that's still a device deal and we also put that under the CE program here.

Speaker 2

So that's not from the streaming services. But as we have touched on before, we believe our video technology, HEVC and other technology, VVC, and frankly, there's alternative implementations for AV1, VP9s, Which we all have very strong IP on, it's very important to the online streaming service and that we define as a greenfield We're working very hard on. We believe that's a very large opportunity and we will try to get recognizing for the value we have delivered to the industry

Speaker 4

times. Great. Thanks so much. I'll get back in the queue.

Operator

All right. One moment for your next question. And for your next question, it comes from the line of Tal Liani from Bank of America. Tal, your line is open. Please ask your question.

Speaker 5

Yes. I have first question is about financials. Can you elaborate on the EBITDA margins this quarter? Also your free cash flow generation strongly outperformed our numbers. Can you touch on the drivers there?

Speaker 5

And lastly, just on the smartphone strength in the quarter, would you mind to summarize again and double click on what drove the strength? Thank you.

Speaker 3

Yes. So I can take those, Tal. So and there's some related thread to all three aspects of your question. The first on the EBITDA margins, it really speaks to the operating leverage that exists within our business. So as we drive Performance on the top line as we did this quarter with the new licenses Liren spoke about principally the Lenovo HEVC agreement.

Speaker 3

There's not really any incremental cost associated with that. So that's a bottom line drop and drives up that margin. That's why we say long term At $650,000,000 we think we can get to maintain a 60% margin because there's just not as much expense growth Necessary to achieve that in our view. Free cash flow, there it's a little bit the margin speaks to Kind of or correlates with cash flow over time, but in the quarter, we coming in, we expected a large customer And I think we referred to that in our guidance at the beginning of the year or the beginning of the quarter. And then also with some of the agreements we signed, We're able to increase the cash receipts in the quarter as well.

Speaker 3

So also in part related to the new agreements. And the Lenovo HEVC deal, it is video codec, but it doesn't apply only to consumer electronics. That also applies to smartphone. So there is an allocation there to smartphone.

Speaker 5

Got it. Thank you. One moment for your next question. And for the next question, it comes from

Operator

the line of Mark Lipacis from Jefferies. Your line is open. Please ask your question.

Speaker 6

Hi, thanks for taking my questions. On the licensing, the streaming IP to cloud service providers, can you To Coppler, can you talk about like how does that play out? Is there an ability To quantify the size of the market or the timing and where would that be a new Category for you? Or is that in CEE and IoT? Or is that in a different category as you play as that plays out?

Speaker 6

And then I had a follow-up. Yes.

Speaker 2

Hey, Mark, this is Lauren. So we mentioned in the prior call and we highlighted this call, so we believe So streaming and online services, cloud services is a very large greenfield for our company. And we have been working on it for frankly multiple years now. And remember with our Technicolor acquisition as well as the combined innovation we have done with InterDigital's engineers, We believe we have one of the largest and probably one of the most valuable, codec IP holding in the industry, And we continue to drive the standard development going forward. So we believe we are really well positioned in that field.

Speaker 2

Regarding the size opportunity here, we obviously the overall time of the market is fairly well known and based on third party report That market for the streaming service alone will be by 2027 to be about the same size as the Overall, smartphone industry in terms of annual revenue. We currently do not have a set number for our revenue target yet, primarily because we want to Frankly, get more clarity on licensing progress before we put target on it. And Once we make more progress and over time, by the way, this is a brand new program. So we do believe it will take time to establish and grow. This will be a new category for us.

Speaker 2

This is not part of the CE program. The CE and IoT program is still focusing on the device side.

Speaker 3

And I'll just add that, therefore, the $650,000,000 device target does not include this opportunity. That's additive To the $650,000,000

Speaker 6

All right. That's very helpful. And a follow-up, if I may, On the just to talk about capital allocation, nice to see that the dividend bump and the buybacks. Rich, can you talk about the cash that you want to have on your balance sheet or like to have on the balance sheet to run the business. And can you talk about how you think about M and A going forward from here?

Speaker 3

Yes. So Mark, good question. We started the year with over $1,000,000,000 in cash. We've returned $360,000,000 to shareholders and we're still sitting here with over $1,000,000,000 in cash because of the cash flow generation of the business, Which is a great thing, but still more cash than we need. So we continue to be aggressive in returning capital to shareholders, You know, provide an update through the end of October, and I expect that to be the case going forward.

Speaker 3

At this point, we're under $80,000,000 on the authorization, but that's something The authorization and buybacks and the dividend, it's something we're looking at every quarter with our So there's a lot of room I think to continue to return capital. With respect M and A, we're always looking for opportunities, but because of the very strong in house research capabilities we have In cellular, in Wi Fi, in video, it's not something that our business model In all categories including the OTT, it's not something that we feel we're dependent on. So it's more opportunistic.

Speaker 6

Got you. And a final question, if I may. Liren, you talked about being cited by was it LexisNexis as a top 5 gs IP player. Can you talk what is the significance of that report? Is that considered Like an authority in the industry, is that something you now can cite during negotiations or during litigation?

Speaker 6

Is that like A piece of evidence of litigation. How can you just talk about the significance of that report? Thank you.

Speaker 2

Yes. Hey, Mark. Yes, there's a new report from Lexus Nexus, which is a quite comprehensive report. What they did do is they look at both the quality as well as the quantity by how many families, how many patents people have That's disclosed to 5 gs standard process. And they have looked at all the patent holders who have declared Potential essential patent to 3 gsPP for 5 gs and there's about 130 companies who hold those patents And running their algorithm, they ranked InterDigital as one of the top 5 in the industry, combining those factors.

Speaker 2

We find this report properly acknowledge our leadership in the industry, even though any such report, there's always frankly different level of nuances people Can comment on. And as far as usefulness for this report, we do frankly demonstrate the overall value to our licensees during negotiation And we do it in frankly a number of different ways. We demonstrate them our category research, we demonstrate the overall portfolio, We give them some 3rd party report, but also we frankly, if they wanted to get much deeper in terms of various proof of use, couple report. And regarding litigations, and this is also one of the things people can point to, but frankly we also bring much more in-depth evidence in those process.

Speaker 6

Very helpful. Thank you very much. Of course.

Speaker 5

Thank you. And for your next question, it comes from

Operator

the line of Anja Soderstrom from Sidoti. Anja, your line is open. Please ask your question.

Speaker 7

Hi, and thank you for taking my questions. Most of them have been answered already. But I'm just curious in terms of the odd opportunity, You noted that you're a founding member now of Avanci. Where are you in terms of that opportunity? And how do you expect that to build up?

Speaker 2

Okay. Hey, Hanyan, good morning. So for the automobile, we are By the way, we were a founding member for the 4 gs, Avanci program and we are quite excited to see how that program has developed over the years. And as we reported in the prior quarter, they have more than 80% of the connected car licensed under 4 gs. So now So 5 gs program has been launched and we are equally excited to be a founding member for 5 gs program.

Speaker 2

So as I said in my prepared remarks, The 5 gs value for connected cars is significantly higher than 4 gs. So therefore, the overall rate It's about doubling the 4 gs rate. So we benefit from essentially a higher value per device Regarding that dynamic, but keep in mind that as of now, about half the cars sold every year are connected, but that's Scheduled to increase as more and more new cars will be all connected. So therefore that I believe the connectivity portion of the 4 gs is growing roughly 15% year over year And then the 5 gs adoption of the Connect Card will also increase. So compounding those two parameters, we feel that give us a very good driving factor Over probably the next 5 to 10 years.

Speaker 7

Okay. Thank you. That was all for me.

Speaker 2

Thank you.

Operator

All right. Thank you. And for your next question, it comes from the line of Arjun Bhatia from William Blair. Arjun, your line is open. Please ask your question.

Speaker 8

Yes. Hey, thanks guys. Laren, maybe for you, the Lenovo The deal is interesting because you have video for both smartphone and CEE, when you look at your smartphone contracts, what kind of room is there to do a cross sell For SAVE, to get some of those smartphone agreements to sign on for CE, IoT as well, I imagine a lot of those customers have both in their portfolio, but where are you in discussions of that And getting those potential licensing agreements signed?

Speaker 2

Yes. So Arun, yes, let me comment on What you said the first part, yes. So we signed the Lenovo deal for the HEVC technology that apply both to their CE, which is primarily their PC As well as the smartphone. So regarding other vendors here, it's somewhat a case by case space because some of the vendors frankly have Primarily smartphone devices, they in those contexts here, we will try to get valuation both for our cellular technology as well as our HEVC technology On the smartphone, but there may be other vendors who have a mix of different products and some of them may be cellular based, some of them may be frankly video Without cellular and some of them may be Wi Fi connected for IoT. So when we negotiate, we have to try to bring all those assets and Highlight how they are benefiting from all of them and try to get paid frankly most of our technology.

Speaker 8

Okay. Got it. And the settlement with Lenovo this quarter For the HEVC, does that have any impact on the other outstanding litigation that you have going with them?

Speaker 2

Yes. So we mentioned as part of the HEVC license, we have dismissed So HCBC related litigation. However, we do have other pending litigation with them as we have disclosed in our 10 Q. And, namely there's a ITC case that filed covering our implementation patents and there's frankly cases pending in Germany That will kick in after the current cellular patent cellular license expires under the UK court decision. So that's sort of related to Lenovo.

Speaker 2

But I do want to add one more thing here, because we have established the value for our HEVC Patent portfolio, we believe that's very useful when we negotiate with other licensees on both the CE and the mobile side. And we also believe that will have a beneficial effect as far as sense on arbitration.

Speaker 8

Okay.

Speaker 3

And Arjun, I'll just add as a reminder that on the U. K. Judgment that we received over the first half of this year, We are conservatively recognizing only a portion of that revenue and have deferred the rest pending the outcome of The appeal, which is we noted in the Q has been scheduled for June of 2024. So we'd expect that to be resolved sometime in the second half of twenty twenty four.

Speaker 8

Okay. Got it. Thanks. And just last one for me, Laren, can you just talk a little bit about how you're thinking about The smartphone opportunity with some of the other Chinese manufacturers, Vivo, Oppo, etcetera, is that a near term Kind of catalyst or something that you're looking at a couple of years out? Yes.

Speaker 2

So we are continuing to make a lot of progress on those negotiations. As we have disclosed before, the largest unlicensed Smartphone vendors are Oppo, Weibo and Lenovo. We talked a lot about Lenovo on this particular call here, but we are also making progress on the Litigation from with OPPO in multiple jurisdictions and we have disclosed the details in our 10 Q filing. Regarding Weibo, we continue to negotiate with them. As we said Multiple times and we always prefer bilateral negotiation.

Speaker 2

And as of now, we have not filed any losses against them yet.

Speaker 8

All right. Thank you, guys.

Operator

All right. Thank you. And we have a follow-up question coming from the line of Scott Searle. Your line is open. Please go ahead.

Speaker 4

Thanks. Two quick follow ups. Rich, on the litigation front, it was a little elevated again this quarter. You got a lot going on. It seems like implied in the guidance for the Q4 that continues.

Speaker 4

But now with Lenovo total resolved, do we expect that to start to come down in 2024? And Liren, on the Avanti front, now that you're throwing your 5 gs intellectual property into the pool for autos, I'm wondering what your plan is for the rest of the IoT world. Will you be looking to use and license that directly? Or is that going to be

Speaker 3

Yes. So Scott, I'll start with the litigation question. Yes. So it was elevated a little bit in Quarter, as we had some activity and we move forward on the Samsung arbitration, the good thing about the Penetration is it's kind of ring fenced and doesn't kind of mushroom into other cases and jurisdictions. But and it's a little bit accelerated We also had, of course, some action in the Lenovo HEVC arena in the quarter as that got resolved, But have other matters with Lenovo.

Speaker 3

So I'm not going to make a call at this point on 2024, just we'll let it stand with the Q4 OpEx guidance.

Speaker 2

Yes. Hey, Scott, regarding the IoT licensing, we frankly are pursuing both direct licensing model as well as pool model. It depends on use case, because as we discussed before, IoT is really a collection of different use cases here. So for some, the more Direct higher value, high dollar negotiations, we our preference generally is through direct negotiation, We are opening for the Puma also in different use cases.

Speaker 4

Great. Thanks.

Operator

All right. So presenters, I don't see any further questions. And I would now like to turn the conference Back over to Liran Chen, your Chief Executive Officer for closing remarks.

Speaker 2

Thank you, operator. Before we close, I'd like to thank our employees for their dedication and contribution to InterDigital as well as our many partners and licensees. Thank you to everyone who joined our call today, and we look forward to updating you on our progress next

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