Entegris Q3 2024 Earnings Call Transcript

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Provided by Quartr
November 4, 2024

Key Takeaways

  • In Q3, revenue grew 7% year-over-year excluding divestitures—below expectations—but gross margin, EBITDA margin, and non-GAAP EPS met guidance amid a slower-than-expected industry recovery.
  • The Material Solutions division delivered 14% sales growth (ex-divestitures), driven by strong demand for CMP slurries and pads, advanced deposition materials, and etching chemistries.
  • Entegris is combining its Advanced Materials Handling (AMH) and Micro Contamination Control (MC) divisions to generate $10–$15 million in annual cost savings, which will be reinvested in R&D and new operational capabilities.
  • New capacity investments are progressing: the Kaohsiung, Taiwan facility qualifications remain on track for N2 ramp and Colorado Phase 1 is completed, with production expected to begin in H2 2025 once the CHIPS grant is finalized.
  • Entegris secured POR wins for molybdenum deposition materials in 3D NAND, positioning the company for incremental content per wafer as moly is implemented in next-year’s NAND node and later in logic.
AI Generated. May Contain Errors.
Earnings Conference Call
Entegris Q3 2024
00:00 / 00:00

There are 12 speakers on the call.

Operator

Welcome to the Entegris Third Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. At this time, all participants have been placed on a listen only mode and the floor will be open for your questions following the presentation. Session. I would now like to turn the call over to Bill Seymour, Vice President of Investor Relations.

Speaker 1

Good morning, everyone. Earlier today, we announced the financial results for our Q3 of 2024. Before we begin, I would like to remind listeners that our comments today will include forward looking statements. These statements involve a number of risks and uncertainties, and actual results could differ materially from those projected in the forward looking statements. Additional information regarding these risks and uncertainties is contained in our most recent annual report and subsequent quarterly reports that we have filed with the SEC.

Speaker 1

Please refer to the information on the disclaimer slide in the presentation. On this call, we will also refer to non GAAP financial measures as defined by the SEC and Regulation G. You can find a reconciliation table in today's news release as well as on our IR page of our website at integris.com. And finally, as a reminder, we have included in the appendix of the earnings slide presentation for your reference consolidated and divisional P and L that exclude divestitures for the Q1 of 2024 and for all 4 quarters of 2023. On the call today are Bertrand Lalotte, our CEO and Linda La Gorga, our CFO.

Speaker 1

With that, I'll hand the call over to Bertrand.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Bill, and good morning. Our 3rd quarter revenue, excluding divestitures, grew 7% year on year, but was below our expectations. Despite the softer top line, gross margin, EBITDA margin and non GAAP EPS were within our guidance. The industry recovery is happening, but it is happening slower than anticipated and visibility continues to be limited. Customers with strong exposure to AI applications are performing well, but the rest of the industry remains challenged.

Speaker 2

And because Entegris serves all parts of the industry ecosystem, including areas like mainstream and NAND, which remain muted, demand for our products is softer than our original expectations. In addition, 2024 continues to be a year of limited technology transitions, which limits our incremental wafer content gain opportunity and our level of outperformance this year. Taking a closer look at our quarterly performance breakdown, MS division sales were up 14% year on year excluding divestitures. Growth was particularly strong in CMP slurries and pads, advanced deposition materials and etching chemistries. The MS division continues to benefit from the combination of the SCEM and APS divisions, which has allowed us to leverage cost efficiencies to increase our R and D investment in support of our customers' technology roadmaps.

Speaker 2

AMH and MC division sales were up slightly in the Q3 year on year. Growth this year in AMH and MC has been impacted by the lower demand from mainstream logic customers, slower new fab construction activity and reduced backlog, which positively benefited sales last year. At Entegris, we are continuously looking at ways to streamline and optimize our operations. To that end, we have decided to combine our AMH and MC divisions. They both support the same mission of enabling materials purity.

Speaker 2

They both serve similar customer segments. They also serve similar applications inside and outside the fab. And AMH is actually one of NC's largest suppliers. With this combined structure, we will develop greater product synergies, optimize our go to market strategy and further increase and differentiate the value we create for our customers. As a result of this combination, we expect to generate $10,000,000 to $15,000,000 in annualized cost savings that will be reinvested to maintain adequate investment levels in R and D and increase investments in new operational capabilities to better meet our customers' evolving expectations, while we continue to operate within the framework of our published target model.

Speaker 2

A few other important items I would like to highlight. Our team at our new facility in Kaohsiung, Taiwan continues to make good progress. Customer qualifications ahead of the N2 ramp are progressing and remain our number one priority. We are also progressing rapidly at our new Colorado site. Construction of the building for Phase 1 is essentially complete.

Speaker 2

Tool installations are starting this quarter and we expect to ramp up production in the second half of twenty twenty five. In addition, we continue to negotiate the final terms of the Chief's Grant award and look forward to completing the process in the coming month. Our investments in Taiwan and Colorado will provide manufacturing capacity to support the significant growth we expect in the coming years. Given the muted industry recovery we have been experiencing for the past several quarters, we remain focused on balancing cost and maintaining strong profitability, while continuing to engage with customers on their technology roadmaps and continuing to fund critical investments that improve our competitiveness and position us for the upturn. On that note, we are pleased with the POR positions we have secured for key new logic and memory nodes.

Speaker 2

In particular, our efforts in molybdenum or moly deposition materials are progressing well. We have already received several key POR wins in Mali and are well positioned for more. We are particularly excited about these POR positions as they represent incremental Entegris content for wafer opportunities, in part because we do not make the deposition materials Moly replaces. We continue to expect Moly will be implemented in the upcoming 3 d NAND node transitions expected next year and in logic sometime later. These wins validate that our customers' technology roadmaps continue to be opportunity rich for Entegris as the drive for more complex device architectures and further miniaturization.

Speaker 2

The resulting process complexity is making our expertise in material science and materials purity increasingly valuable, which is expected to fuel our market outperformance and incremental content per wafer opportunities in the years to come. Let me now turn the call over to Linda. Linda?

Speaker 3

Good morning and thank you, Bertrand. Our sales in the Q3 of $808,000,000 were up 7% year over year, excluding the impact of divestitures. On an as reported basis, our sales were down approximately 9% year over year and down 1% sequentially. Foreign exchange negatively impacted revenue by $1,000,000 year over year and positively impacted revenue by $3,000,000 sequentially in Q3. Our sales in the 3rd quarter were below our expectations, driven by softer overall semi market, especially in mainstream and 3 d NAND and discrete supply chain constraints.

Speaker 3

Gross margin on a GAAP and non GAAP basis was 46 percent in the 3rd quarter within our guidance range. Operating expenses on a GAAP basis were $236,000,000 in Q3. Operating expenses on a non GAAP basis in Q3 were $186,000,000 below our guidance. Adjusted EBITDA in Q3 was 28.8 percent of revenue within our guidance range. Net interest expense was $50,000,000 in Q3.

Speaker 3

The GAAP tax rate in Q3 was approximately 10% and the non GAAP tax rate was 13%. GAAP diluted EPS was $0.51 per share in the 3rd quarter. Non GAAP EPS was $0.77 per share within our guidance range. Sales for our MS division in Q3 were $347,000,000 Sales were up 14% year on year, excluding the impact of divestitures. Sales were up 1% sequentially.

Speaker 3

The largest contributors to the sales increase were CMP slurries and advanced deposition materials. Adjusted operating margin for MS was 20.7 percent for the quarter, approximately flat sequentially. Our AMH division sales Q3 of $182,000,000 were up 1% year on year and were down 3% sequentially. The sequential decline was primarily driven by lower demand of our CapEx driven micro environments products. Adjusted operating margin for AMH was 16.8% for the quarter.

Speaker 3

The 140 basis points sequential increase in margin was primarily driven by lower spending. Q3 sales for our MC division of $287,000,000 were up slightly year on year and were down 2% sequentially. Revenue was down across most major product lines except for gas filtration. Adjusted operating margin for MC was 33.7% for the quarter, up 180 basis points sequentially. The sequential increase in the margin was driven by lower spending and a more favorable mix.

Speaker 3

Moving on to cash flow. 3rd quarter free cash flow was $115,000,000 CapEx for the quarter was $82,000,000 We now expect to spend approximately $300,000,000 in total CapEx in 2024, down from our previous expectation of $350,000,000 While not reflected in the Q3 balance sheet, shortly after the end of the quarter, we paid down $65,000,000 of the term loan from cash on hand, which means to date we have paid down approximately $1,900,000,000 of total debt since the close of the CMC acquisition. The blended interest rate on the debt portfolio is approximately 4.9%. And since the term loan is fully hedged, currently 100 percent of our debt is fixed. As of the beginning of October, our gross debt was approximately $4,100,000,000 and our net debt was approximately $3,800,000,000 Gross leverage was 4.6 times and net leverage was 4.2 times.

Speaker 3

We will continue to use our free cash flow to repay debt and we remain committed to reducing our leverage. Moving on to our 4th quarter outlook. We expect sales to range from 810,000,000 dollars to $840,000,000 This equates to a year on year revenue growth of approximately 8% excluding divestitures. We expect the EBITDA margin to range from 28.5 percent to 29.5 percent consistent with the flow through of our target model we shared at our Analyst Day. We expect GAAP EPS to be $0.49 to $0.56 per share and non GAAP EPS to be $0.75 to $0.82 per share.

Speaker 3

Let me provide additional modeling information for Q4. We expect gross margin of 45.5 percent to 46.5 percent, both on a GAAP and non GAAP basis. GAAP operating expenses of $232,000,000 to $236,000,000 and non GAAP operating expenses of $186,000,000 to $190,000,000 We also expect depreciation of approximately $48,000,000 net interest expense of approximately $52,000,000 and a non GAAP tax rate of approximately 15%. I'll now hand it back over to Bertrand for some closing remarks.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Linda. In closing, for the full year, excluding divestitures, we expect sales to grow 4% and we expect EBITDA to grow 8%, continuing to demonstrate the leverage that exists in our model. As Linda noted, we also remain committed to paying down debt and lowering our leverage. While 2024 is a year of transition for the semiconductor industry, looking ahead, we remain very confident about the growth prospects for both the industry and for Entegris. In the meantime, we continue to manage through a soft market environment focused on delivering strong profitability in line with our target model, while making the necessary investments to position us for the future.

Speaker 2

With that, operator, let's open the line for questions.

Operator

Thank you. The floor is now open for questions. And our first question is coming from Toshiya Hari with Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.

Speaker 4

Hi, good Bertrand, I guess on 2024 and your view into 2025, I think based on your updated outlook, you're taking down 2024 revenue by about 85,000,000 dollars I know you spoke to a couple of factors driving the reduction, but if you can sort of expand on what you're seeing in mainstream and NAND, that would be super helpful. And then into 2025, you talked a little bit about molybdenum. I think there's an expectation for gate all around to provide a tailwind to your business as well. How are you thinking about your ability to outperform the market? And if you can sort of provide some quantitative feel into 2025, the rate of outperformance, that would be super helpful.

Speaker 4

Thank you.

Speaker 2

Yes. Thank you, Toshiya. So let me start with our view on the market for 2024, which has evolved. I mean, obviously, about a quarter ago, we're expecting the industry to grow at about 3% of use or more moderate with the expectation that the industry will be growing at about 1% to 2%. And that comes from wafer starts up modestly, think about plus 1% range roughly, and that's a function of strength in advanced logic, obviously.

Speaker 2

But memory remains very subdued and mainstream remains very challenged. So the net of that again wafer starts up about 1% in 2024. Industry CapEx is also a little bit of a tale of 2 cities with WFE up and improving, and we expect WFE to be up in the mid single digit in 2024. But fabs contraction activity has declined, and we expect that to be a headwind for CapEx. So overall CapEx, our view is that it's going to be up in the low single digit in 2024.

Speaker 2

So in that context, we expect to outperform the industry by about 3 points this year on a constant currency basis. A lot of the growth is obviously coming from our Material Solution division. But again, I think it's a difficult industry backdrop for us to outpace the industry simply because there hasn't been a lot of node transition this year, none in logic and very modest transitions in memory. So and you're inviting me to provide maybe and contrast the picture going into 2025. And qualitatively, I would agree with your implied statement.

Speaker 2

We expect the industry to be in a better state and we expect to see more activity in terms of node transitions, both in logic as well as in memory where we expect in NAND in particular, we expect the transition to 300 layer plus devices and then hopefully the introduction of molybdenum next year. And all of that actually should create the conditions for us to be able to operate on the higher end of our market outperformance range of 3 to 6 points.

Speaker 4

That's really helpful. And then as my follow-up on the molybdenum opportunity, you mentioned you expect adoption in 2025. I was hoping you could sort of contextualize the opportunity for us. I know for Entegris, no one product group or application accounts for a large percentage of revenue, but I do get this question a lot from investors. How should we think about the magnitude of the tailwind in 2025 as hopefully a couple of your customers make that transition?

Speaker 4

And I know you talked about Logic adopting molybdenum in the out years as well. So how big is the opportunity for you into 2025 and how big could it be over the medium to long run? Thanks.

Speaker 2

Yes, Toshi, as you will understand, I won't provide a quantification to my answer simply because the timing of the adoption is still not entirely set. So a lot of things could move and obviously will impact the magnitude of the module opportunity for us in 2025. But we feel really good about our competitive standing. We believe that we have developed a film that is of great quality, and we believe that we have developed a comprehensive delivery solution for the material that actually provides the lower cost of ownership for our customers, both of which being obviously very important for our customers, especially at a time when they need to decide when to introduce molybdenum in a high volume manufacturing. So we feel good about where we stand today.

Speaker 2

Obviously, a lot of work for everyone in the ecosystem before moly is fully adopted at in high volume, but we feel good about where we stand today.

Speaker 4

Got it. Thanks, Bertrand.

Operator

Thank you. And our next question is coming from Bhavash Lodea with BMO Capital Markets. Please go ahead.

Speaker 5

Hi, good morning, Batra. Maybe to follow-up on that conversation. So in the current backdrop of slower mainstream growth, you are exiting the year with a sales growth of around 8% year over year. Now expectations are for MSI to grow faster next year. You also have more fab startups next year.

Speaker 5

Is it fair to say all else equal, you would see top line growth of at least 8% next year and then hopefully a faster or a stronger outperformance over that?

Speaker 2

Look, I will not quantify our views about 2025 on this call today. It's just too early for us to do that. But as I said, I think there are reasons to be optimistic in terms of the industry and MSI in particular. We believe that the inventory digestions that have been a major headwind in memory and in mainstream will largely be behind us or should be behind us as we turn into 2025. We also expect better conditions for the PC refresh cycle going into 2025.

Speaker 2

So all of that should be a basis for better industry fundamentals for 2025. But again, I'm not going to comment and I'm not going to quantify all of that on this call today.

Speaker 5

Understood. And maybe a couple of questions on your Taiwan TSP facility. Is the time line for customer qualifications in line with what your expectations were? Are they on time? Are they slower?

Speaker 5

And then are you still seeing the $40,000,000 of sales that you expected for this year?

Speaker 2

Yes. So I think the qualifications are progressing well and they remain our number one priority, right? It's very important for us to try to qualify as many of the KSP made products ahead of the N2 ramp next year. So if you look at the fluid handling and the deposition materials, the qualifications are mostly complete. For our liquid filters, it's taking a little bit longer as expected.

Speaker 2

And it's taking longer because we chose actually to not take a copy exact approach when transferring the manufacturing capacity there. We changed both the process and we changed the supply chain. By that, I mean, we wanted to be relying more on local chemical suppliers or regional chemical suppliers. So all of that will yield long term benefits for sure in terms of shorter lead times and a more resilient supply chain. But it just takes longer for both us and our customers to qualify the line.

Speaker 2

But we're pleased with the progress. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And our next question is coming from John Roberts with Mizuho. Please go ahead.

Speaker 6

Thank you. Well, AMH and MCV reported separately in the December quarter?

Speaker 2

Yes, they will. Okay. No, no, no, I'm sorry, you mean separately. No, no, no, no. We will combine I'm sorry, yes, we will combine them starting Q4 of this year.

Speaker 6

Okay. And then what kept you from doing this earlier? And what keeps you from combining MS as well and going to just being a one segment company?

Speaker 2

Well, I think that there are really 2 parts to our value proposition. 1 is really around Materials Purity and then the other one is really around Materials Solutions. So we went through a little bit of an experiment last year when we combined SCM and APS, and that experiment paid off. I think we were able to generate cost synergies, which did allow us to increase the level of reinvestment into R and D. And we've seen actually evidence of the returns on those investments in the form of the success that we're seeing in Moly, the deposition materials, but also Moly Etch.

Speaker 2

Also great progress in slurry. If you look at advanced foundries, we believe that for the next node, we should have twice as much revenue in terms of slurry revenues. And that's again a function of the new level of investment in R and D and the new focus that we've been able to drive within that division. So that experiment worked really well last year for SCM and APS, and we thought that it was time to actually do the same for AMH and MC. So we something that we had been thinking about in the past to your point, but I think we were emboldened by what we saw in SCM APS.

Speaker 2

So again, as I said, very similar customers, very similar applications. Think about the solutions we develop for the bulk chemical manufacturers, the solutions that you will find in the chemical loops, in the sub fabs, but of course also all of the solutions in the wet tools in the fab floor. So a lot of affinity between the two divisions, which will allow us to generate cost savings by eliminating the redundant cost of the support functions for 2 divisions. I would expect also a more optimum go to market strategy with a greater customer coverage, greater impact. And ultimately, I think that by combining the R and D organizations, I would expect to unlock new product development synergies, which ultimately will drive further differentiation.

Speaker 2

So I think that having 2 segments, 2 divisions is the right way to organize the company and it's very consistent by the way with the way we've been describing our value proposition to investors and to customers.

Speaker 7

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And we will take our next question from Melissa Weathers with Deutsche Bank. Please go ahead.

Speaker 8

Hi there. Thank you for letting me ask a question. On the leading edge side, can you help us I know we've got for good news on the gate all around side, even the 3 nanometer nodes appear to be doing well. So can you help us reconcile the weakness that you're seeing and the strength that you're seeing on the AI side at the leading edge? And then especially ahead of the gate all around node ramps, can you talk about like any lumpiness or how do the customer behavior like purchasing patterns differ at the beginning of a node cycle versus once they ramp into high volume production?

Speaker 2

Yes. So I mean, I think look, if you look at our revenue going into advanced foundry, I mean, we are seeing very healthy growth as you would expect, right? And we don't offer customer details on those calls. But if you look at Taiwan as a proxy, you will see that year to date we are growing at 15%. And again, it's a combination of a number of different players on this particular geography.

Speaker 2

So highlighting the strength of Advanced Foundry and the benefit of AI related demand. When it comes to your second question around the shape of the revenue opportunity during a new transition. So when it comes to consumable products, it starts with early orders of filters to flush the lines. And we are actually seeing some of that in Q4 of this year. And we're going to see an acceleration of that in the beginning of next year.

Speaker 2

And then you will see actually the first orders for chemistries and materials. I expect to see some of that in the Q1 of next year. And the levels of demand for both of those products will start normalizing after you go through the first phase of inefficiencies that are inherent to those types of ramp. So it's always something that we discover with the customers. It's hard to entirely forecast.

Speaker 2

But so that's the way to think about the evolution of the opportunity in the early stages of a ramp.

Speaker 8

Thank you. That kind of helps with my next question. But so now that you've resegmented a couple of times, you've divested a few businesses. Can you help us think about like normal seasonality? And I don't want you to like guide 2025 or anything, but are there any big quarters, especially with your consumables business and your materials business, any big quarters or lower quarters that we should appreciate?

Speaker 2

Well, I think the last few years have been anything but normal. So it's a little bit hard to talk about normal seasonality. But I would say in a normal year, Q1 is usually a slower quarter and that you see actually an acceleration in Q2, Q3.

Operator

Thank you.

Speaker 2

Sure.

Operator

Thank you. And we will take our next question from Atif Malik with Citi. Please go ahead.

Speaker 9

Hi. Thanks for taking my question. My first one is for Linda. Linda, in your prepared remarks, you talked about the 3Q being a bit weaker because of discrete supply chain constraints. Can you expand on that comment?

Speaker 2

Yes, I can take that, Atif. So there were 2 issues really impacting our MC division, 1 impacting our gas purification system platform and then the other one impacting our liquid filtration platform. The first really had to do with getting access to a very specific valve. It's been an ongoing problem, but it became a real issue in Q4. The second impacting our liquid filtration products was really a contaminated batch of HCL, so hydrochloric acid that so we are in the process of sorting through those two issues.

Speaker 2

I would expect to see some improvement in both cases in Q4, but it will largely take until the beginning of next year for us to be totally out of those 2 supply chain issues impacting MC.

Speaker 9

Got it. Thank you, Bertrand. And from an excellent, Bertrand, I remember on the June quarter earnings, you guys saw stability in China. Can you talk about what you saw in domestic China or overall China in September quarter? And what are you seeing into the December quarter?

Speaker 2

China has been growing at about 16% on a compounded average growth rate for the last 4, 5 years. China is about a 20% region for us, so it's meaning full, but we don't quite have the same level of exposure as some of the equipment makers. But I would expect that number to be in the 20% to 25% range simply because a lot of new fabs have been built in China, and we would expect those fabs to start ramping production in the months and quarters to come. So again, good steady business and demand from our Chinese customers.

Speaker 7

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And we will take our next question from Charles Hsieh with Needham. Please go ahead.

Speaker 9

Hi, good morning. Hi, Batuang. I do want to have a follow-up question on the overall market environment here. I think 90 days ago, you were directionally correct mainstream going lower into second half of the year and that you were right about NAND not quite seeing a recovery. But I think so far the theme of this call looks like mainstream and NAND seems to be the main factors contributing to the weakness.

Speaker 9

Wonder versus 90 days ago, can you give us a little bit color of what has changed more to the worse, especially for these two segments, especially combined with the way you just said, the China seems to be continued to do well. It looks like non China, especially on the mainstream side, has done a lot worse. Mind if you provide some more color to that? Thank you.

Speaker 2

Yes, Charles, I think you're right. I think mainstream has been more troubled than we were expecting. We've seen steady reduction in fab utilization. We've seen customers being intensely focused on reducing inventory levels of products, Entegris products. And that extends even to SIC.

Speaker 2

SIC remains a bright spot for mainstream customers, but our views for SIC related demand has come down and has continued to come down. We started the year thinking that SAIC would be up for us about in excess of 50%. We revised that to up around 30% based on customer forecast at the end of Q3 at the end of Q2. And right now, we believe that SIC will only be up 10%. So it's up.

Speaker 2

It remains a bright spot for mainstream fab. But overall, mainstream fab activity is down quite a bit. If we look at it just as an entire segment for us, it's down in the high single digit in terms of and that's, I think, consistent with the level of MSI that we estimate for mainstream fabs in 2024.

Speaker 9

Thanks, Bachand. So the other question about China, it sounds like I look at historical numbers that the China was roughly in the low to mid teens. This year, it looks like it's going to be 20% -ish or maybe plus. What's the long term what's the projection here? I think I heard you saying 20%, 25%.

Speaker 9

Just want to clarify, is that the long term projection of China contribution or maybe I missed it. Thank

Speaker 2

you. Yes. This is exactly true. So you're right that about 4, 5 years ago, China was representing about 15%, 17% of our revenue. Today, it's tracking at about 20%.

Speaker 2

We expect longer term that number to be between 20% 25%, mostly consumable products going into mainstream fabs.

Speaker 9

Does that is that the reflection of maybe China taking more share in the mainstream production or something else?

Speaker 2

I think it's just the volume of activity in China. I think the jury is still out in terms of market share from Chinese players versus non Chinese players. I don't think I have enough visibility to comment on that.

Speaker 9

Thanks, Batra.

Speaker 2

Sure.

Operator

Thank you. And we will take our next question from Tim Arcuri with UBS.

Speaker 7

Thanks a lot. Bertrand, can you talk about export controls? There was an article in the journal this morning about the U. S. Cutting off the ability to buy Chinese components.

Speaker 7

And I suspect when this stuff comes out that it will also go the other way that they're going to make it harder for the local Chinese companies to buy from the U. S.-based supply chain as well. So, and it seems like it's going deeper into the supply chain this time. So can you talk just about that? And is there any combination in the December guidance or in like how you're thinking about next year for this?

Speaker 2

Yes, Tim, I mean, I think you're right. I mean, this is a fast evolving topic. Like you, we are keeping track of what we're hearing from regulators. But as of right now, we have nothing really new to report, right? Our focus is to comply on known regulations.

Speaker 2

And I don't think we are prepared to really speculate on potential future regulations. And to your question about have we included any have we tried to quantify any negative impact to potential future regulations to outlook? The answer is no.

Speaker 7

You've not. Okay. And then maybe could you give us an idea between the segments for MS and this newly combined MC and AMH? Are they is one of them any better in December than the other?

Speaker 2

Yes. So I think we expect NC to be the fastest growing division in Q4. Again, there's a lot of work to be done to resolve or to partially resolve some of the supply chain issues. But I would expect MC to report a record quarter in well, we won't report MC specifically, but that business, as you know, has been performing really well. I would expect them to reach a new high level of revenue that is greater than what we were achieving during the pandemic level.

Speaker 2

So again, that business is doing really well. I think the next fastest division would be MS, Material Solutions. But as Linda would remind me again, we'll report along the lines of 2 segments in Q4.

Speaker 7

Right. Okay. Thank you, Bertrand.

Speaker 4

Sure.

Operator

Thank you. And we will take our next question from Christopher Parkinson with Wolfe Research. Please go ahead.

Speaker 10

Great. Good morning.

Speaker 4

Bertrand, can

Speaker 10

we just get your latest thoughts on how we should think about Entegris' opportunity as it relates to data centers and HPC in terms of just how that theme has progressed throughout the year? Thank you.

Speaker 2

Yes. Well, I think the hyperscalers obviously have been driving a lot of the demand for AI chips and we've like everybody else, we've benefited from the strong activity in advanced foundry. We believe that, that trend is going to continue into 2025 and that's going to be another hopefully a positive driver for the semiconductor recovery in 2025. But as I said, I'm not quite ready to quantify any of those statements on this call today.

Speaker 10

Sorry. And just maybe a quick comment on just how we should be thinking about the effect of the Taiwan ramp in the second half? And how we should think about that as it relates to progress into 2025, so not necessarily quantification? And then also maybe just a quick comment or update on Colorado Springs would be very helpful. Thank you.

Speaker 3

Sure. So as we think about KSP and Colorado, obviously we do have ramp inefficiencies. We do include that in our published target model that we published in Analyst Day and we will continue to manage to the 40% EBITDA flow through. To give you a sense in 2024 year over year, the Taiwan facility impact on gross margin is about 80 basis points year over year. And then as you move into 2025, we're going to have more sales ramping up in the Taiwan facility that will help alleviate those pressures.

Speaker 3

But approximately mid year, Colorado is going to be coming online and we're going to have some gross margin inefficiencies there. So you move into 26 and as sales ramps, that's when you're going to start to see those inefficiencies from the ramps alleviate.

Speaker 10

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And we will take our next question from Aleksey Yefremov with KeyBanc Capital Markets. Please go ahead.

Speaker 11

Thanks. Good morning. Bertrand, in Mali, did you win other products than deposition materials? And what is the opportunity beyond deposition materials? What product categories are mostly benefiting from this?

Speaker 2

Yes, it's a great question. So when we talk about money material, first, in the deposition space, you have the end fuel, you have the delivery cabinets and number of Entegris and Surrey solutions around those 2 platforms. And then you have the recessed chemistry. So for NAND, it's going to be MOLLE Edge, and we are working very diligently to get, TOR wins there as well. And then when MOLI is then introduced in Logic, there will be a polishing step, which doesn't exist in the 3 d NAND application.

Speaker 2

And we are working, as you would expect, on developing a slurry solution for Moly polishing down the road.

Speaker 11

Thanks. And just a bigger picture question on node transitions. Again, since the last call, has your view on sort of the benefit or the magnitude of node transitions in 2025, has it changed at all for better or worse?

Speaker 2

As of right now, the answer is no. Our view remains unchanged. As I mentioned, we expect a fair amount of activity in advanced logic. And I cited obviously the all important transition to 300 layers in 3 d NAND and hopefully again the inclusion of Moly as part of that transition. But as I said, I think this is still fluid.

Speaker 2

Customers direct the timing of those node transitions. I hope to be in a better position to give a little bit more precision to all of that in our Q4 earnings call in late January, early February.

Speaker 11

Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. And we will take our last question from Mike Harrison with Seaport Research Partners. Please go ahead. Please go ahead, Mike Harrison. Your line is open.

Operator

Please double check the mute function on your device. And it appears that we have no further questions at this time. I will now turn the floor back over to Bill Seymour for closing remarks.

Speaker 1

Thank you and thank you for joining our call today. Please reach out to me directly if you have any follow ups. Thank you again and have a good day. This concludes our call.

Operator

Thank you. This concludes today's Entegris 3rd quarter 2024 earnings conference call. Please disconnect your line at this time and have a wonderful day.

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