SouthState Bank Q3 2025 Earnings Call Transcript

Quartr
Provided by Quartr
October 23, 2025

Key Takeaways

  • Positive Sentiment: Strong quarterly results — EPS rose ~30% YoY to $2.58, PPNR was $347M and return on tangible equity was 20%, indicating meaningful earnings accretion from the Independent Financial acquisition.
  • Positive Sentiment: Loan production and pipelines are building — Q3 loan production was nearly $3.4B, management expects net loan growth to accelerate with sizable pipelines (Texas $1.2B, Florida $1.0B, Atlanta $0.9B) and plans to recruit bankers to capture market dislocation.
  • Negative Sentiment: One large credit loss — Q3 included a $21M charge-off tied to a First Brands supply‑chain finance exposure (no prior reserve), pushing quarterly charge-offs to 27 bps though management says underlying credit metrics remain stable and they expect ~10 bps for the year.
  • Neutral Sentiment: Margin outlook and accretion dynamics — Reported NIM was 4.06% this quarter (boosted by higher accretion); management guides core NIM to roughly 3.80%–3.90% for Q4/2026, with accretion expected to decline to $40–50M in Q4 and ~$125M in 2026 and deposit beta modeled around 27%–30%.
  • Positive Sentiment: Capital optionality — CET1 is 11.5% and tangible book value per share rose to $54.48 (over $3 above YE‑24 despite merger dilution), giving the bank flexibility to fund organic growth or repurchase shares.
AI Generated. May Contain Errors.
Earnings Conference Call
SouthState Bank Q3 2025
00:00 / 00:00

There are 10 speakers on the call.

Operator

Hello, and thank you for standing by. My name is Bella, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to South State Bank Corporation Q3 twenty twenty five Earnings Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speakers' remarks, there will be a question and answer session.

Operator

I would now like to turn the conference over to Will Matthews. You may begin.

Speaker 1

Thank you. Good morning, and welcome to South State's third quarter twenty twenty five earnings call. This is Will Matthews, I'm here with John Corbett, Steve Young and Jeremy Lucas. As always, we'll make a few brief prepared remarks and then move into questions. I'll refer you to the earnings release and investor presentation under the Investor Relations tab of our website.

Speaker 1

Before we begin our remarks, I want to remind you that comments we make may include forward looking statements within the meaning of the federal securities laws and regulations. Any such forward looking statements we may make are subject to the Safe Harbor rules. Please review the forward looking disclaimer and Safe Harbor language in the press release and presentation for more information about our forward looking statements and risks and uncertainties that may affect us. Now I'll turn the call over to you, John.

Speaker 2

Thank you, Will. Good morning, everybody. Thanks for joining us. We're pleased to report a strong third quarter for South State. Earnings per share are up 30% in the last year and the company generated a return on tangible equity of 20%.

Speaker 2

If you recall, we closed on the independent financial transaction in January. We converted the computer systems in May and now we're beginning to realize the full earnings power of the combined company. Loan production was up a little in the third quarter to nearly $3,400,000,000 and we saw moderate growth in both loans and deposits. Payoffs were about $100,000,000 higher in the quarter. Loan production in Texas and Colorado was up 67 since the first quarter of the year.

Speaker 2

And loan pipelines across the company continue to grow and we feel like net loan growth will accelerate over the next few quarters. Our charge offs were 27 basis points for the quarter, primarily due to one larger C and I credit acquired with Atlantic Capital that has been in the bank a number of years. Stepping back, however, the credit metrics in the bank are stable. Payment performance is good. Non accruals are down slightly, and we've only experienced 12 basis points of charge offs year to date.

Speaker 2

Our credit team is forecasting that we're going to land in the neighborhood of 10 basis points of charge offs for the year. We're currently in the middle of strategic planning this time of year and thinking about the banking landscape, deregulation and the opportunities in front of us. Over the last fifteen years, we've built the company in the best markets with good scale and an entrepreneurial business model. And we've done the heavy lifting to build out the infrastructure of the bank. We're now in a perfect position to capitalize on the disruption occurring in our markets.

Speaker 2

We've calculated that there are about $90,000,000,000 of overlapping deposits with South State that are in the midst of consolidation in the Southeast Texas and Colorado. Our regional presidents understand the opportunity and they're laser focused on recruiting great bankers and organically growing the bank in 2026. Will, I'll turn it back to you to provide additional color on the numbers.

Speaker 1

Thanks, John. I'll hit a few highlights focused on our operating performance and adjusted metrics and make some explanatory comments and then we'll move into Q and A. We had another good quarter with PPNR of three forty seven million dollars and $2.58 in EPS, driven by $34,000,000 in revenue growth and solid expense control. Our four zero six tax equivalent margin drove net interest income of $600,000,000 up $22,000,000 over Q2. Dollars 19,000,000 of that growth was due to higher accretion.

Speaker 1

Cost of deposits of $191 were up seven basis points from the prior quarter and were in line with our expectations. In addition to the cost of deposit increase, overall cost of funds was impacted by the larger amount of sub debt outstanding for much of the quarter. We redeemed $4.00 $5,000,000 in sub debt late in the quarter. Going forward, that redemption will have a net positive impact on our NIM of approximately four basis points all else equal. Our loan yields of 6.48% improved by 15 basis points from Q2 and were approximately eight basis points below our new origination rate for the second quarter.

Speaker 1

And loan yields excluding all accretion were up one basis point from Q2. Steve will give updated margin guidance in our Q and A. Non interest income of $99,000,000 was up $12,000,000 driven by performance in our correspondent capital markets division and deposit fees. On the expense side, NIE of $351,000,000 was unchanged from Q2 and was at the low end of our guidance. And our third quarter efficiency ratio of 46.9% brought the nine month year to date ratio to 48.7%.

Speaker 1

Credit costs remain low with a $5,000,000 provision expense. As John noted though, we did experience one $21,000,000 loan charge off during the quarter, which is an abnormally large charge off for us. This brings our year to date net charge offs to 12 basis points. Absent that loss, net charge offs would have been nine basis points for the quarter. Asset quality remains stable and payment performance remains good.

Speaker 1

Our capital position continues to grow with CET1 at 11.5% and TBV per share growing nicely. As you'll recall, we closed the Independent Financial acquisition on January 1. Our TBV per share of $54.48 is now more than $3 above the year end 2024 level, even with the dilutive impact of the Independent Financial merger. Our TCE ratio is also back to its year end '24 level. As we've noted before, our strong capital levels and healthy capital formation rate provide us with good capital optionality.

Speaker 1

Operator, we'll now take questions.

Operator

Your first question comes from the line of Michael Rose with Raymond James. Your line is now open. Please go ahead.

Speaker 3

Hey, good morning guys. Thanks for taking my questions. I guess I'll hit the margin question, since you brought it up Will. Steve, can you kind of walk us through the excess accretion this quarter? Looks like the core margin ex accretion was down kind of high single digit basis points.

Speaker 3

Can you just give some puts and takes here as we think about the contemplation of a couple of rate cuts this quarter near term? And then if you can talk about some of the pricing dynamics both on the loan and deposit side, new production yields, things like that. Just trying to better frame up the core versus the reported margin as we move forward. Thanks.

Speaker 4

Sure, Michael. Yes, I just maybe kind of give you some explanation of where we think we're headed on margin and maybe I can answer some of those questions in the middle of that. As you mentioned, we had higher accretion than we expected. And really, a couple of things around that. We saw the highest accretion in July and then August and September kind of tailed off a little bit.

Speaker 4

And really, due to some early payoffs of 2020 and 2021, Venice loans had kind of three handle coupons with these big discounts that sold. So those are not economic decisions, but they're I mean, they're economic decisions, the fact that they sold, but typically you keep those coupons. Also, we had a 29% decline in PCD loans this quarter, and of course, those have larger marks. So anyway, all of that, we look at prepayments. They're really not outside of our scope of what we thought.

Speaker 4

It's just that some of the vintages were different than we thought and therefore have bigger discounts. So having said all that, as we think about the guidance for NIM going forward, really not a lot of change, a little bit of change, but not a lot. We talk about size, the assumptions of the interest earning asset size. The second is our interest rate forecast. The third is loan accretion.

Speaker 4

The fourth is deposit beta in an environment where rates are going down. Interest earning assets, we've been saying $59,000,000,000 for quarter four average. That's no change. For full year 2026, we're looking somewhere between 61,000,000,000 and $62,000,000,000 So that's kind of a mid single digit growth. Rate forecast.

Speaker 4

Last quarter, we had no rate cuts in our model. This quarter, we're thinking we get three rate cuts in 'twenty five and quarterly rate cuts, three more in 2026. So that we would get 150 basis point cut in total and get the Fed funds up 3% by the '6. That seems to be somewhere where the market is. As it relates to the third assumption, loan accretion, based on our models, we expect loan accretion this quarter for the fourth quarter to be somewhere in the 40,000,000 to $50,000,000 as expected prepayments fall.

Speaker 4

Our October accretion so far is in line with these expectations. And as I mentioned, August and September came down pretty rapidly. So I think that's a good run rate to use. For 2026, we did certainly pull some forward in 2025. So we'd expect instead of 150,000,000 of accretion, we're looking at about $125,000,000 based on our prepayment forecast.

Speaker 4

But of course, it can be lumpy based on the advantage loans. The last part is deposit data. For the first 100 basis points of cuts, our deposit cost came down about 38 basis points from 2.29% to 1.91%, so 38% beta. In our twenty nineteen to twenty twenty easing cycle, our deposit beta was around 27%. So our expectation is with growth plans that our deposit beta would look a little similarly to 2019, 2020, so 27%.

Speaker 4

Maybe we get to 30% over time with a lag, but I don't think it will be as high as 38%. So based on all those assumptions, we'd expect NIM to continue to be in the $3.80 to three ninety range with the step down in accretion this quarter in fourth quarter and for 2026 for it to be in that range three eighty to three ninety as we kind of move forward. But one of the questions you asked was our pricing dynamics. Our new loan production rate for the total company this quarter was six fifty six. If you look at Texas and Colorado, that new loan rate was six seventy nine.

Speaker 4

So it's a little bit higher in Texas and Colorado, but it's in total of six fifty six. So I know you have a few questions, few puts and takes, but that's some guidance for you.

Speaker 3

No, it's really helpful, Steve. I appreciate it. And then maybe just a broader one for John. I think you mentioned that loan production was up a little bit in the third quarter. I think there's clearly going to be some dislocation in some of your markets from some of the deals that have been announced.

Speaker 3

I know you guys are obviously leaning a little bit more into Texas and maybe Colorado as well with some of that.

Speaker 5

Can you just kind

Speaker 3

of walk us through the loan growth environment at this point given the fact that I think a lot of banks are kind of upping their hiring plans for loan officers, the pricing dynamics and kind of maybe what we should expect as we move forward? Thanks.

Speaker 6

Yes. Sure, Michael. Good morning. We kind of guided to mid single digit growth for the remainder of 2025. I think we came in at 3.4% for the quarter, so a little bit less than mid single.

Speaker 6

But we still think mid single digit growth for the remainder of the year feels about right. As I said, we had about $100,000,000 more in paydowns in the third quarter than we did in the second. If we move into 2026, it could move higher,

Speaker 7

maybe in the mid-

Speaker 6

to upper single digits, but we're have a better feel for that in January. But most of the loan growth is coming in, in the area of C and I. For the quarter, we had 9% linked quarter annualized growth in C and I. Resi growth was about 6%. And then if you combine C and D and CRE, really, were flat for the quarter.

Speaker 6

There was a migration of construction loans that just migrated into CRE upon completion of construction. Our biggest pipeline build is in Texas. We had an $800,000,000 pipeline there in the second quarter end of the second quarter. Now it's up to $1,200,000,000 So we kind of got past the conversion there. And now we're starting to see the pipeline for the activity building.

Speaker 6

Florida's got $1,000,000,000 pipeline. Atlanta's got a $900,000,000 pipeline. So those are our three probably largest markets. And as I said on the call, with that dislocation in really all the states we're in, we are kind of leaning in on the hiring front, and we see opportunities to recruit bankers. Yesterday morning, I was interviewing one from another bank.

Speaker 6

So that is where a lot of our focus and effort is right now.

Speaker 3

All right. Great. I appreciate you guys taking my questions. Thanks.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Jared Shaw with Barclays. Please go ahead.

Speaker 7

Hey, good morning everybody.

Speaker 6

Hi, Jared.

Speaker 7

Maybe just if we could hit on credit. You were listed as a creditor to First Brands. I'm guessing that's what the large charge was. Was there for that charge, was there a prior it looks like there was a prior reserve. Was there also a prior charge taken against that?

Speaker 7

And I guess how do you feel about the rest of the portfolio apart from that?

Speaker 6

Yes. You're correct. That's what that charge was. There was not a prior reserve. I mean, that news happened pretty fast.

Speaker 6

But that was our only supply chain finance credit. So as we examine the portfolio, we don't have any more of that type of lending. So unfortunate, we're going to use it as a learning lesson for our credit team and management associates.

Speaker 1

And I'd say, Gerald, on the reserve question, based on what John just said, we would have had a reserve release but for that charge off in the quarter, I. E. A negative provision just based on the underlying economic loss drivers. And we just to be clear, we did charge off the full amount of that balance in the third quarter.

Speaker 7

Okay. All right. Thanks for that. And then I guess looking at capital, you just gave some great color on some really good growth opportunities over the coming years, but still seeing growth in capital and with like you said, Will, there's an improving backdrop on credit. Where do you feel like you would like to see Q1 optimally and how should we think about the buyback and capital management in general from here?

Speaker 1

Yes, Jared. It's a good question. We're obviously 11.5% on CET1, about 10.8 if you were to incorporate AOCI. So very healthy capital ratios. And I'd say we don't articulate a particular target out

Speaker 7

there, but

Speaker 1

we do like this 11% to 12% range we're and we do like the optionality we've got with the ratios being strong and with the formation rate being so good. So we are hopeful, as John said, to take advantage of some of the disruption in the market through growth, but we also have the ability to use some of that capital to repurchase our shares. It's sort of a quarter to quarter decision we'll be making.

Speaker 7

Okay, great. Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Catherine Mealor with KBW. Please go ahead.

Speaker 8

Thanks. Just one follow-up back on the margin. It was helpful to have your guidance for next quarter. And is it fair to assume that actually, this is the way to ask the question. Is there a way to quantify how much of the accretion this quarter was just accelerated versus just helping us to kind of model what a normal kind of base level would be for accretion going forward versus how much is accelerated from paydowns?

Speaker 4

Yes, Kevin. There's a couple of things that I don't want to overcomplicate your answer, but it's complicated. There's a few things that go into it. One is full payoff, like we talked about, and there's partial prepayment. So based on our models, when we were looking at it and to give you that forecast in the last quarter, it was based on our expected prepayments.

Speaker 4

And our expected prepayments actually came in reasonably well. What we didn't get right was the vintage part of it as well as other partial prepayments. So the bottom line is what we saw in July and early August was a little bit outsized. What we saw in August, September is much more run rate type of thing. So I think this 40 to 50, that's kind of what we expected in the fourth quarter, the back half of the year.

Speaker 4

That's sort of what we're seeing. So that sort of informs us going into 2026.

Speaker 8

Okay. Got it. That's helpful. And then on fees, any outlook into how you're thinking about fees maybe into the fourth quarter and then into next year, it was really nice to see another quarter of higher correspondent and service charges?

Speaker 4

Sure. No, it was a really good quarter. Noninterest income was 99% versus 87%, so a nice pickup, 60 basis points of average assets, a little bit higher than our guide of around fifty-fifty 5%. Two thirds of that was capital markets. A couple of things happened in correspondent.

Speaker 4

Number one, we have changes in interest rates. And so when you have changes in interest rates, that business typically does a little bit better. It was sort of broad based. A couple of million dollars was due to fixed income, maybe 3,000,004 million dollars with higher interest rate swaps, another 1,000,000 point dollars in sort of other trading. So I think we had to I see that that number was around 25,000,000 so that's $100,000,000 run rate.

Speaker 4

So to put it in context, our best year ever was $110,000,000 in revenue. Last year was 70,000,000 So this quarter was a really good quarter. So I don't expect that to we'll see to continue to repeat. But clearly, had a good quarter. We'll see what the run rate I think we get a couple of quarters behind us.

Speaker 4

We'll have a better view. But clearly, it's higher than our run rate of 87. I'm not sure we're as high as 99. So I'd say it's probably, you know, as we kind of think about 2026, you know, somewhere in that $370,000,003 $80,000,000 run rate. It's probably not a bad place to start, and then we'll just see how it progresses is the way I would think about it.

Operator

Okay. That's helpful. Thank you. Your next question comes from the line of Janet Lee with TD Cowen. Please go ahead.

Operator

Good morning.

Speaker 4

Good morning.

Operator

Morning. On a core basis, I believe from your second quarter earnings call, you talked about how every 25 basis point cut would be a one to two basis point improvement overall margin. Is there any change in thoughts on that? Or was that guidance was that guidance based on the core NIM? Was that including any accretion?

Speaker 4

No. That's a great question, and thanks for asking it. A couple of things there. So if we get back to six cuts and we get one to two, that would be, call it, let's just take the midpoint, that'd be nine basis points. So I think our core NIM is somewhere as I think about core NIM, somewhere in the mid three eighties.

Speaker 4

So what's changed there? Number one is the loan accretion forecast. So if we, next year, we are a 125 versus a 150 just because we pull forward, that's that's about four basis points of, you know, decrease. And then the other is just on the deposit beta, you know, and the lag thereof, kinda where you know, like I mentioned in our other question, our deposit beta so far, the first 100 was 38%. But on the other hand, we we didn't grow deposits more than, you know, call it, two two and a half percent.

Speaker 4

So as we contemplate the future and we look back at history at 02/1920 during that easing cycle when we were growing a little bit faster, more mid single digit ish, our deposit beta was more like 27%. So we're taking that model back down to 27%. We hope to outperform that, call it there's a lag, the CDs and pricing and all that. But by the beginning of 'twenty seven, our hope would be we'd be in that 30% range. But for right now, what we're seeing in front of us, we don't see that really we see that more of a lag, and we're modeling 'twenty seven in our numbers.

Speaker 6

So Steve, does when you translate what you're saying there, to Janet's question, about one to two basis points with each cut, that may take that away if the deposit beta is not as good on

Speaker 4

a way down. Right. And then, yes, to finish that thought to your point, John, to finish that thought, if our deposit beta so we're guiding sort of in the midrange of March to March. And and so to the extent at the end of the year next year, we go through the cuts and we start moving our deposit beta from '27 closer to '30, 31, that would get us in the high 380s, maybe $3.90 at the end of the year of 2026. That's how we're thinking about modeling it.

Operator

Got it. Thanks for the color. And just a follow-up. If I if I am not making this up, hopefully. I believe that the IBTX bankers, that group will start adopting South State's business model.

Operator

And in a way, what would be the implication on or any implication on the expenses or their incentive to bringing like prioritize lower deposit costs or loans? Or is there any sort of change that could be coming or whether an implication on growth profile there? Could you could you give us on any color on what that could mean for SOX8, that transition?

Speaker 6

Yes, sure. Janet, it's John. So we went through this transition year in 'twenty five when we did the conversion, and we kind of kept the incentive system at IPTX the same as it had been in prior years. In 2026, it will move to the more of the South State approach where we allocate P and Ls to the regional presidents. So their incentive will be based on both loan growth but predominantly on their PPNR growth.

Speaker 6

One of the things that we're contemplating making an adjustment for to incent additional recruiting and hiring is not to penalize those regional presidents for the first year compensation of new hires to encourage recruiting efforts into 2026, both with the existing South State plan and the IVTX plan. Good question. Hope that helps you.

Operator

Thank you.

Speaker 6

Is there another question?

Operator

Yes. One moment please. Mr. McDonald, your line is now open.

Speaker 9

Okay. Thank you. Sorry, didn't hear anything. Hey, guys. Sorry, just one more follow-up, Steve, on the margin.

Speaker 9

I think your prior outlook was to be in the $380,000,003 90,000,000 and then drift higher in 2026. Just want to make sure that the 2026 outlook three point eight zero three point nine zero includes rate cuts and about $125,000,000 of accretion, if I heard that right. Anything's changed from prior? What are some of the puts and takes?

Speaker 4

Yes. No. I think I was trying to answer that in the prior question. It's really the accretion number that from 150,000,000 is what we thought in 2026 last quarter to 125,000,000 That's about four basis points of decrease. Then the rate and then on the deposit beta, we have 38 percent 2019 was 27%.

Speaker 4

We were thinking we think ultimately we'll get to somewhere in the low 30s, but it just is probably a bit of a lag. So it's probably not going to we're going to be very diligent on growing for the loan growth we think is coming. And so we think we should, in 2026, model more in the 27% range. And then, hopefully, as the CDs reprice, all those kind of things through 2027, we could see it uptick. So I think, you know, back to the the the guidepost through how this would work is you start out in the mid-380s and then move higher '20 '6, early 'twenty seven.

Speaker 1

And John, this is Will. I would add, our margin position is as neutral as we've seen it in years just based upon the actions we took in 2025. Number

Speaker 7

one,

Speaker 1

the merger and marking that balance sheet properly. And then two, the portfolio restructuring we did in connection with the sale leaseback. So we have a relatively stable looking margin under most reasonable scenarios.

Speaker 9

Got it. And the delta between having a four handle this quarter and moving into 380s next quarter is really accretion going from 80 this quarter and cut in half to 40 next quarter in your outlook?

Speaker 4

Yes, that's right. Yes. And that's what we're currently seeing. Yes.

Speaker 9

Okay. And then one just follow-up again on next quarter's average earning assets in the 59. It seems like that's kind of where you were this quarter. Are there some kind of puts and takes of what you expect in terms of growth in the fourth quarter?

Speaker 4

Yes. Typically, in the fourth quarter, we have some seasonal deposit growth and some of we let depending on how we manage it, we get some of the seasonal wholesale stuff out of the bank at the same time. So we sort of manage it towards that level. But of year over year, I'd call it mid single digit growth is kind of how we're thinking about it from an average earning asset.

Speaker 7

Okay. Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Ben Gurlinger with Citi. Please go ahead.

Speaker 5

Hi, good morning.

Speaker 7

Hi.

Speaker 5

I was wondering if we kind of stepping back to correspondent banking. I understand that a rate cut or rate movement kind of sparks it, but we're looking kind of, I don't know, three you said roughly three to six cuts over the next twelve ish months. How long is the tail for that kind of tailwind, I guess you could say? So if there's two cuts in December or excuse me, two cuts in the fourth quarter, would the first quarter also see a benefit? Is it fairly short lived?

Speaker 4

Yeah. That's like I was trying to explain before, you know, as you kind of think about that business, the the highs and lows of it back in 2020 when things went, you know, crazy on on rates. I think our best year was a 110. I think we did that in 2020, 2021. Last year was our worst when rates were the highest and sort of, out there.

Speaker 4

So that was about 70,000,000. You know, as I kind of think about that business, you're going to have fixed income. We'll do better in rate cuts lower because, particularly for our bank clients, they'll want to take their excess cash and buy bonds because there'll be a yield curve. You know, on the interest rate swap side, depending on the shape of the yield curve, it may not be as good as it is today. Today, it's deeply inverted.

Speaker 4

That's really good for that business. So I kinda see those businesses sort of offsetting each other, but maybe creating some stability, at that level.

Speaker 5

Got it. Okay. That's helpful. And then from a follow-up perspective, it seems like you have a lot of opportunity in front of you.

Speaker 7

I think that's that'd

Speaker 5

be hard to disagree, especially the other disruption in the markets that you operate in. Is it fair to think you're going to think organically, like you're hiring individuals obviously and growing loans? Or could you potentially see a small bolt on deal or something like that?

Speaker 6

Yes, Ben. It's John. With our particular fact pattern, kind of our view is to investing in South State's more interesting right now than doing an M and A deal. And that investment at South State comes in two forms. The first way is just to increase our sales force and accelerate our organic growth because of all this dislocation that's going on in the markets.

Speaker 6

And the second way, as Will described, is in purchasing South State shares through our buyback authorization. The capital formation rate is pretty strong right now and the valuation is pretty attractive. So that's kind of how we're thinking about priorities on capital.

Speaker 5

Got you. Appreciate it. Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Gary Tenner with D. A. Davidson. Please go ahead.

Speaker 7

Thanks. Good morning. I just wanted to go back to the NIM related discussion for a minute. The big delta as I look at average balance sheet was really the cost on the transaction and money market accounts up 11 basis points quarter over quarter. Can you kind of talk about the dynamics around that?

Speaker 7

Is it an effort to bring in some new deposits with anticipation of stronger growth over the next year? Or just maybe comment on kind of the driver there?

Speaker 4

Yes. Back in July when we had the call, Gary, we've talked about the our expectation of deposit costs. And we talked about the range this next quarter. The third quarter is 185 to 190,000,000 So we were it was 191,000,000 so we were on the higher end of the range, missed it by a basis point. But really, what drove that was and our expectation was that, particularly in the CD book, we if you looked at the second quarter, the third quarter, or excuse me, the first quarter, second quarter, our CDs went from, I don't know, 7.1 or two or something, 7.7, I think.

Speaker 4

And and that was, you know, back to funding and loan growth and getting the balance sheet where it needed to be. And and so, you know, those obviously transacted at higher rate level than, you know, others. So as we kinda think about that's kinda what's part of our guidance. It's, you know, frankly, a tough environment right now with, deposits, but, you know, we expect that as we get rate cuts and the curve gets a little bit more steady, we could continue to see better. That's why a little bit why we're guiding down on the on the 27% deposit beta because ultimately, we need to fund the loan growth that we think is in front of us.

Speaker 7

Right. And then as a follow-up on that beta, since you just mentioned it as well. To be clear, that 27% to 30% beta is relative to the next phase of easing as opposed to cumulative, including last year's?

Speaker 4

Right. Correct. The next that's right. That's a great way to say it. Yes.

Speaker 4

So you're right. If we had to average them, it'd probably be somewhere in the whatever, low to mid-30s. But yes, that's right. It's the next incremental. Yes.

Speaker 7

Okay, great. And if I could sneak in a last question. Just on the NIE, I think you had guided previously to bit of a step down in the fourth quarter, I think, to the $340,000,003 50,000,000 range. Any change to that outlook for the fourth quarter?

Speaker 1

Gary, I think our guidance for Q4 is still in that 3.45 to $3.5 range. There's always some variability that's hard to predict with respect to how some of the commission compensation businesses perform. Loan origination volume could impact your FAS 91 cost deferral. But somewhere in that roughly $5,350,000,000 dollars range. We're pretty clean now in terms of recognizing the cost saves on independent.

Speaker 1

If you look at Q3 to Q2, was flat even though we had the annual merit increases for most of the company except for executives July 1. But yes, things were flat. So we've done a good job of getting costs out and getting them out pretty early. Looking ahead to '26, we hadn't talked about that, but I might as well address that. Our planning is obviously still underway.

Speaker 1

We still think for 26%, the mid single digits is a good guide. Maybe it's an inflationary sort of 3% plus another percent or so for some of the investments in organic growth initiatives like John addressed. So maybe that's what 2026 will look like. We're still, as I said, finalizing our planning there, but that's kind of what we're thinking right now.

Speaker 4

Thank you.

Operator

Your next question comes from the line of Gary Tenner with Davidson. Please go ahead.

Speaker 1

That was Gary we just spoke with.

Operator

Oh, I'm so sorry. That concludes the Q and A session. I will now turn the call back over to John Kurbot for closing remarks.

Speaker 6

All right. Thank you, Bella. Thank you all for calling in this morning. We, as always, appreciate your interest in our company. And if you have any follow-up questions on your models, don't hesitate to give us a ring.

Speaker 6

Have a great day. Thank you.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, that concludes today's call. Thank you all for joining, and you may now disconnect. Everyone, have a great day.

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