Ampco-Pittsburgh Q2 2025 Earnings Call Transcript

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August 13, 2025

Key Takeaways

  • Negative Sentiment: Amco reported adjusted EBITDA of $8.0 M in Q2, down $2.1 M year-over-year, and a net loss of $7.3 M, including a $6.8 M UK exit charge.
  • Positive Sentiment: Management expects the wind-down of the UK cash roll facility to drive at least a $5 M annualized operating income improvement once complete.
  • Positive Sentiment: The Air and Liquid Processing segment delivered a 15% increase in Q2 adjusted EBITDA and 36% year-to-date growth, its highest performance to date.
  • Negative Sentiment: Forged and Cast Engineered Products plant utilization fell about 10% from last year due to tariff uncertainty pausing customer orders, negatively impacting margins.
  • Positive Sentiment: Amco extended its credit facility through February 2030, ending the quarter with $9.9 M cash and $34.2 M of undrawn revolver availability to support liquidity.
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Earnings Conference Call
Ampco-Pittsburgh Q2 2025
00:00 / 00:00

Transcript Sections

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Operator

Welcome to the Ampco-Pittsburgh Corporation Second Quarter 2025 Earnings Results Conference Call. All participants will be in listen-only mode. If you need assistance, please signal a conference specialist by pressing the star key followed by zero. After today's presentation, there will be an opportunity to ask questions. To ask a question, press star, then one on your telephone's keypad. To withdraw a question, please press star, then two. Please note this event is being recorded. I would now like to turn the conference over to Kim Knox, Corporate Secretary. Please go ahead.

Kim Knox
Kim Knox
Corporate Secretary at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp.

Thank you, Gary, and good morning to everyone joining us on today's Second Quarter 2025 Conference Call. Joining me today are Brett McBrayer, our Chief Executive Officer, and Mike McAuley, Senior Vice President, Chief Financial Officer, and Treasurer. Also joining us on the call today are Sam Lyon, President of Union Electric Steel Corporation, and David Anderson, President of Air & Liquid Systems Corporation. Before we begin, I would like to remind everyone that participants on this call may make statements or comments that are forward-looking and may include financial projections or other statements of the corporation's plans, objectives, expectations, or intentions. These matters involve certain risks and uncertainties, many of which are outside the corporation's control.

Kim Knox
Kim Knox
Corporate Secretary at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp.

The corporation's actual results may differ significantly from those projected or suggested in any forward-looking statement due to various risk factors, including those discussed in the corporation's most recently filed Form 10-K and its subsequent filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission. We do not undertake any obligation to update or otherwise release publicly any revision to our forward-looking statements. A replay of this call will be posted on our website later today. To access the earnings release or the webcast replay, please consult the investors' section of our website at amcocgh.com. With that, I would like to turn the call over to Brett McBrayer, Ampco-Pittsburgh's CEO. Brett?

Brett McBrayer
Brett McBrayer
CEO at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

Thank you, Kim. Good morning and thank you for joining our call. As reported in our press release issued yesterday afternoon, Ampco-Pittsburgh Corporation reported an adjusted EBITDA of $8 million for the second quarter of 2025. The quarterly results were negatively impacted by a pause in customer orders as they await clarity on tariffs. As a result, our forged and cast engineered product groups shut down production to adjust working capital through portions of the period. A major focus in the quarter was on our UK cast roll facility where we continue to experience significant losses. Progress on the wind-down of this facility has progressed well as we work to accelerate right-sizing our portfolio. Once this action is complete, we expect a minimum of a $5 million operating income improvement on an annualized basis.

Brett McBrayer
Brett McBrayer
CEO at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

Our air and liquid processing segments saw a 15% increase in adjusted EBITDA in the quarter versus prior year and the highest year-to-date adjusted EBITDA in our segment's history. The growth in this business's performance continues to be impressive. For further details regarding our segment performance, I'll turn the call now over to Sam Lyon, President of our forged and cast engineered product segment.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

Thank you, Brett, and good morning. For the second quarter of 2025, FDEP reported net sales of $77.9 million, a 3% increase compared to Q2 of 2024, and a 7.8% increase compared to Q1 of 2025. Segment adjusted EBITDA for Q2 of 2025 was $6.8 million, down $1.5 million from Q1 of 2025. Our U.S. forged plant utilization in the quarter was 10% lower than Q2 of 2024 and 14% lower than Q1 of 2025, primarily due to lower work roll demand caused by elevated customer inventory positions on forged work rolls, partially resulting from a reduction of activity due to the fluid tariff environment. The decrease in plant utilization and lower revenue and margin from forged work rolls negatively affected earnings in Q2. Forged engineered products demand and shipments were a positive development from the tariffs.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

We were able to increase pricing on this product line as barriers to imports increased. The mix shift from forged rolls to forged engineered products reduced overall margins, yet strategically positions us to cash for reshoring opportunities in pooled steel, distribution bar, and block products. Looking at the flat-rolled market environment, demand in North America and Europe remains weak, with many U.S. customers postponing roll purchases in Q2 due to tariff uncertainty following the administration's expansion of Section 232 duties and unknown levels of base tariffs. For U.S. imports from our Sweden and Slovenia plants, the baseline tariff now stands at 15%, up from 10% in Q2. The cast roll market in North America exceeds domestic capacity, so long-term demand for our European cast rolls should not be affected by these tariffs.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

The tariff effects in the short term should reflect in our second half expectations as a temporary shortfall, particularly in North America. Notably, the long-term fundamentals remain strong. Construction spending, automotive production, and canned sheet demand are all expected to grow at mid-single-digit rates over the next five years, supporting a return to more normal roll ordering patterns. As we previously indicated, we have issued formal notice to the Union of our intention to wind down operations at our UK cast roll plant. We are engaging with multiple potential asset buyers. The current backlog takes us through Q1 of 2026, and we are reallocating products across the global Union Electric Steel Corporation network to ensure continued customer supply while working to wrap up operations as soon as possible. We have stopped taking new orders for the UK.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

In summary, although tariff-related hesitation is reducing near-term North American demand for rolls, our pricing discipline, cost control measures, and expanding forged engineered products volumes give us confidence going into 2026. As stated earlier, cast roll supply is limited in the U.S., allowing us to be competitive with other European suppliers. To date, we have passed on all tariff costs to our customers. We anticipate a full order book for 2026 at our cast roll plant in Sweden and the closure of the UK operations providing meaningful improvement in operating income for this segment once complete. Brett, back to you.

Brett McBrayer
Brett McBrayer
CEO at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

Thank you, Sam. David Anderson, President of Air & Liquid Systems Corporation, will now cover his segment's results.

David Anderson
President at Air and Liquid Systems Corp

Thank you, Brett. Good morning. 2025 continues to be a very positive year for Air & Liquid Systems Corporation. In Q2, order activity continued to be very good. Our backlog at the end of Q2 was 8% higher than the start of the year. The nuclear, military, and pharmaceutical markets continue to be strong. Q2 revenue was consistent with prior year, however, the product mix was improved. Revenue for pumps was higher than prior year, and we continue to see positive results from the military markets. Heat exchanger shipments declined versus prior year due to the timing of some large orders that are expected to ship in Q3. Adjusted EBITDA in Q2 was $3.9 million versus $3.4 million in the prior year. The 15% increase versus prior year was primarily driven by better product mix.

David Anderson
President at Air and Liquid Systems Corp

Year-to-date adjusted EBITDA of $7.7 million was the highest in Air & Liquid Systems Corporation's history and a 36% increase over prior year. We continue to see positive activity in the nuclear market for our heat exchanger product line. Orders have already exceeded any prior full year, and we expect shipments to also be at record levels this year. From restarting legacy nuclear plants to the new small modular reactors, nuclear power has become the preferred power option, and our engineering and manufacturing capabilities position us well as this market grows. There continues to be strong demand from the U.S. Navy, and we expect this demand to continue as the Navy moves forward with fleet expansion plans. New manufacturing equipment from the Navy funding program is expected to arrive at our facility by the end of 2025. This is from the Navy-approved funding in 2024.

David Anderson
President at Air and Liquid Systems Corp

In addition to the equipment being delivered this year, we are pleased to announce that Air & Liquid Systems Corporation has been approved for another equipment funding from the U.S. Navy. This new funding was approved in May and was approximately $2 million that will be used to purchase additional equipment for our Buffalo manufacturing location. This equipment, along with the equipment we installed in 2024, will position us to meet the expected growth in this market. Demand for custom air handling units remains strong. From upgrading existing facilities to increasing research and manufacturing capabilities in the United States, there continues to be tremendous demand in the pharmaceutical market for our custom air handling products. Tariffs continue to be a major subject in the last few months, and the recent copper tariff will impact many products.

David Anderson
President at Air and Liquid Systems Corp

Copper is a main component of our heat exchangers, and we have notified our customers that we will be passing on any tariff costs in turn. While there may be some short-term fluctuations as the supply chain adjusts, in the long term, anything that results in increased manufacturing in the United States will increase demand for our products. In summary, demand for our products remains strong. Backlog is up 8% this year, and year-to-date adjusted EBITDA increased 36% versus prior year.

Brett McBrayer
Brett McBrayer
CEO at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

Thank you, Dave. At this time, Mike McAuley, our Chief Financial Officer, will announce more details regarding our financial performance for the quarter.

Mike McAuley
Mike McAuley
SVP, CFO, and Treasurer at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

Thank you, Brett. As indicated in both our Form 10-Q and in our press release 8-K filed yesterday, the major headline item for the quarter was the UK exit charge. The recorded $6.8 million in expenses related to employee severance, accelerated depreciation due to the plant's shortened operating life, and certain professional fees associated with the plant closure. As indicated and itemized in note two of our Form 10-Q, these costs are recorded against the respective cost of goods sold, SG&A, and depreciation and amortization expense line item on the consolidated CNL. To reiterate, we expect that following the exit from this location, operating income is expected to improve by at least $5 million on an annualized run rate basis. Ampco-Pittsburgh Corporation's net sales for the second quarter of 2025 were $113.1 million, an increase of 2% compared to net sales for the second quarter of 2024.

Mike McAuley
Mike McAuley
SVP, CFO, and Treasurer at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

The increase was primarily driven by higher sales of forged engineered products and favorable FS translation, which more than offset lower roll demand. Adjusted EBITDA of $8 million for the second quarter of 2025 declined by $2.1 million versus prior year, primarily due to lower margins in the forged and cast engineered product segment for a few key reasons. Unfavorable manufacturing costs relative to pricing and further pass-throughs in the current quarter than in the prior year quarter. A lower volume of roll shipments offset by a higher volume of forged engineered product shipments led to a weaker margin mix in Q2 2025 versus the prior year quarter, and lower production rates in the current year quarter led to lower absorption of manufacturing overhead costs.

Mike McAuley
Mike McAuley
SVP, CFO, and Treasurer at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

These impacts were partly offset by higher profitability during the quarter versus prior year in the air and liquid processing segment due to a better sales mix as Dave described. 2025 year-to-date adjusted EBITDA of $16.8 million remains up versus prior year. Total selling and administrative expenses declined slightly for the second quarter of 2025 versus prior year, but are comparable year-to-date versus prior year. Depreciation and amortization expense for the quarter and for year-to-date are higher than prior year period due to the accelerated depreciation piece of the UK exit charge, which was $0.7 million. Severance costs of $5.9 million on the Q2 P&L are the employee-related severance costs that represent the largest element of the total UK exit charge. Interest expense for the second quarter declined slightly, primarily due to lower average interest rates on revolving credit facilities.

Mike McAuley
Mike McAuley
SVP, CFO, and Treasurer at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

The change in other expense income nets was driven primarily by changes in foreign exchange transaction gains and losses. The income tax provision for 2025 is benefiting from a lower statutory tax rate in one of our foreign tax-paying jurisdictions. As a result, net loss attributable to Ampco-Pittsburgh Corporation for the three months ended June 30, 2025, was $7.3 million or $0.36 per share, which includes $6.8 million or $0.34 per share for the UK exit charge. At the end of June, we amended and extended our credit agreement to 2030. We restructured the facility into a $100 million revolving credit line backed by eligible accounts receivable and inventory, plus a $13.5 million term loan backed by certain eligible machinery and equipment. The structure and added capacity provide us greater flexibility to support our global working capital needs.

Mike McAuley
Mike McAuley
SVP, CFO, and Treasurer at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

At closing, we fully drew on the term loan to pay down the revolver balance, which significantly increased the corporation's available liquidity. At June 30, 2025, the corporation's liquidity position included cash on hand of $9.9 million and undrawn availability on a revolving credit facility of $34.2 million. Operator, at this time, we would now like to open the line for questions.

Operator

We will now begin the question and answer session. To ask a question, you may press star, then one on your telephone keypad. If you are using a speakerphone, please pick up your handset before pressing the keys. To withdraw your question, please press star, then two. At this time, we will pause momentarily to assemble our roster. Again, if you have a question, please press star, then one. Our first question comes from Dennis Scannell with Rutabega Capital. Please go ahead.

Dennis Scannell
Analyst at Rutabaga Capital Management

Yes. Good morning, gentlemen. I was hoping to get a little bit more color on what's going on in the roll market from Sam, if I could. Sam, in your conversations with customers, and kind of what you saw for the month of July, is there some pent-up demand or are you seeing either actual orders in July or the promise of orders later in the year coming? Is this happening both in the U.S. and in Europe, or is it really mostly in the U.S.? I'm just trying to get a sense of how the back half of the year might look for your business.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

Yeah, Dennis, the second half of the year will be lighter shipment on rolls than the first half, one, because we have less days and more holidays. The overall demand, the lead time on our products is depending where it's shipping. If it's in the U.S., it's three months. If it has to go overseas, it would take, you know, four or five months. Vice versa, if you're going to ship from overseas to here, it's five months. You're kind of in the really back half. We could take orders for November, December kind of timeframe. We have seen a slight uptick in order activity from a few of our large customers. What's really happening is there was a pause. There was a couple of unknowns in Q2. One, what was the tariff rate going to be?

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

It was set at 10%, and then it ultimately ended up being 15% for our plant, our plant in Slovenia, our plant in Sweden that ships to the U.S. It has no effect on their shipments into Europe, of course. The European customers we have didn't know if there was going to be a retaliatory tariff or not until just recently, and now there is not. For the future, you know, we would anticipate to be in a pretty good position, one, because the dollar has weakened somewhat, making the U.S. shipments into Europe more favorable, making our cost position better. That's a positive. Now it's a known the tariffs are 15%. They're not 20% or 30% or 40%. Rolls are not subject to the steel tariff, so it's a total tariff of 15%. It's not 15% plus the 50% for steel. It's just 15%.

Dennis Scannell
Analyst at Rutabaga Capital Management

Right.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

Now all that's known, we feel like, you know, things start happening again. Specifically, Dennis, where we saw the degradation in ordering was really Europe into the U.S. and U.S. to U.S. The activity in the U.S. plants slowed a bit. There's a third factor, and that is that in 2024, we had a pretty high shipment level of forged work rolls. I think our customers were anticipating an uptick in overall fuel demands. The tariffs had hurt automotive production and hurt some other, you know, the interest rates. The housing market, housing starts are lower. You know, that's offset somewhat by non-residential construction and data centers being high. There's just a lot of questions around how much are things going to cost, how much is it going to be, even our infrastructure projects. Now that that's all, seems to be settled, we expect things to go back to normal.

Dennis Scannell
Analyst at Rutabaga Capital Management

To the extent that the lack of demand or lack of orders has been a U.S. event, we could conceivably see increased U.S. ordering activity and that affecting the second half of 2025. You said it's like a three-month lead time, right? Do you expect that? As you talk to your customers, do they, the U.S. customers, still have a pretty high inventory of rolls? That's what I'm thinking of. Some orders, maybe in August or September, are not going to materialize. Any color on that, on that standpoint?

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

I guess I'll say it's due to the lead time of parts and materials and things. We would be shipping, we would be delivering in November, December for any incremental new orders. We have seen a little bit of uptick, but it's hard to say. Each customer is different. Some customers are plugged with cash and they need more inventory, and they can wait longer. Some are not, and they have to order, they're hand-to-mouth and they're ordering to get stuff as soon as they can. It's pretty variable, actually.

Dennis Scannell
Analyst at Rutabaga Capital Management

Got it. Any other color you can give on the closure of the UK facility in terms of the timing? Is that something that will happen kind of second half of 2025 and then we get that $5 million incremental operating income bump in 2026? Or will this drag on longer?

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

The longest potential endpoint is Q1 of 2026. We're working to pull that in. Sometime in Q4, most likely between October and December, the casting will drop and those costs will stop. That's the major energy consumer in the plant and about 30 employees. The rolls will progress through to the backend machining. As the rolls get finished, the employees will be attributed and costs will continue to come down. At the same time, as those costs are coming down, you're still shipping product. You start getting receipts in from the customers. From a cash perspective, it starts at high, and then you start receiving it back in.

Dennis Scannell
Analyst at Rutabaga Capital Management

Yes. Okay. You mentioned, do we own the plant, and do you have a sense of potential proceeds if we do actually sell the facility?

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

We do own it, and it's being evaluated right now. It's in a, I'll call it a fairly desirable area in Newcastle. You have to evaluate, it's been there for a long time. What's the demolition cost versus the redevelopment cost? Does the, you know, maybe the ASET Council want it? We're not sure. The government's interested potentially to develop it, and then there's private people. It's really hard to say. We're not counting on anything, but there could be sometimes.

Dennis Scannell
Analyst at Rutabaga Capital Management

Got it. Okay. Great. Thank you very much. Good luck.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

Thanks.

Operator

Once again, if you have a question, please press star, then one. The next question is from Robert Jensen, a private investor. Please go ahead.

Yeah, I'm just wondering, in you guys closing a UK operation, how is that going to impact your revenues?

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

Yeah. That's the same, Robert. It will be down about $25 million-$29 million, roughly $25 million-$30 million, I'd say. There's some upside to offset that with converting some rolls to forged rolls of $3 million or $4 million. I'd say in the neighborhood of $20 million-$25 million, something like that.

Okay, thank you.

Sam Lyon
President at Union Electric Steel Corp.

The reason it's not larger is we're shipping some product to Sweden as well. Sweden will end up being full. You know, they're running at a lower utilization rate right now, so that'll be an offset.

Yeah. Okay.

Operator

This concludes our question and answer session. I would like to turn the conference back over to Brett McBrayer for any closing remarks.

Brett McBrayer
Brett McBrayer
CEO at Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp

Thank you. In closing today, I want to recognize the great work by our employees. I particularly want to highlight the work of our team in the UK who are managing a very difficult situation. I also want to thank our shareholders and Board of Directors for continuing support. Despite the pause in our order book, we've recently experienced tariff clarity, and the wind-down of our UK operations will position us well as we move into 2026. I'm excited about our direction and the commitment of our teams to demonstrate significantly improved earnings for our shareholders. Thank you again for joining our call this morning.

Operator

The conference is now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

Executives
    • Brett McBrayer
      Brett McBrayer
      CEO
    • Kim Knox
      Kim Knox
      Corporate Secretary
    • Mike McAuley
      Mike McAuley
      SVP, CFO, and Treasurer
Analysts
    • David Anderson
      President at Air and Liquid Systems Corp
    • Dennis Scannell
      Analyst at Rutabaga Capital Management
    • Sam Lyon
      President at Union Electric Steel Corp.
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