HCA Healthcare Q3 2021 Earnings Call Transcript

Quartr
Provided by Quartr
October 21, 2021

There are 6 speakers on the call.

Operator

Welcome to

Speaker 1

the HCA Healthcare Third Quarter 2021 Earnings Conference Call. Today's call is being recorded. At this time, for opening remarks and introductions, I would like to turn the call over to Vice President of Investor Relations, Mr. Mark Hingbro. Please go ahead, sir.

Speaker 2

All right, Chris. Thank you so much. Good morning, and welcome to everyone on today's call. With me this morning is our CEO, Sam Hazen and CFO, Bill Rutherford. Sam and Bill will provide some prepared remarks, and then we will take questions.

Speaker 2

Before I turn the call over to Sam and Bill, let me Remind everyone that should today's call contain any forward looking statements, they are based on management's current expectations. Numerous risks, uncertainties and other factors may cause actual results to differ materially from those that might be expressed today. More information on forward looking statements and these factors are listed in today's press release and in our various SEC filings. On this morning's call, we may reference measures such as adjusted EBITDA, which is a non GAAP financial measure. The table providing supplemental information on adjusted EBITDA and reconciling Net income attributable to HCA Healthcare, Inc.

Speaker 2

Is included in today's release. This morning's call is being recorded, and The call will be available later today. With that, I'll turn the call over

Speaker 1

to Sam. Sam? Good morning and thank you for joining us. The 3rd quarter The most intense period yet for us with the COVID pandemic. The delta variant surged and drove significant demand for our services.

Speaker 1

For the quarter, COVID patients accounted for 13% of total admissions. This level compares to 3% in the 2nd quarter, 10% in the Q1 and 11% in the Q4 of last year. Our teams provided record levels Inpatient share during the quarter, which drove revenue growth of 15% as compared to the prior year. Inpatient revenue grew 18% and outpatient revenue grew to 11%. As compared to prior year and also 2019, Same facility volumes increased across all major categories with the exception of inpatient surgery.

Speaker 1

Surgery volumes were constrained because capacity was used for treating COVID patients. This growth was supported by a better payer mix of commercial business. Adjusted EBITDA margin was strong at over 21%. Diluted earnings per share, Excluding gains on sales of facilities increased to $4.57 which is a notable increase over the prior year, Even considering that last year's Q3 included a $1.72 per share effect Of the reversal of the government stimulus income, which as you may recall, resulted from our decision to return We'll repay early approximately $6,000,000,000 of governmental assistance we received from the CARES Act. Once again, our colleagues and physicians delivered for our patients and for our communities.

Speaker 1

I'm tremendously proud of their dedication In service to others, I want to thank them for their great work. As we look to the remainder of 2021, We have raised our annual earnings guidance again to reflect the strong performance of the Company. Now, let me transition to some early General perspectives on the upcoming year. Just like in 2020, we are providing some preliminary thoughts in the midst of a very fluid environment, which obviously makes it challenging given the uncertainties that continue to exist with the pandemic. We plan to provide more details with our annual guidance in January after we complete our planning process for 2022.

Speaker 1

By that time, we hope to have a few more months of results that are more indicative of a normal operating environment, that is a non COVID surge environment to analyze and give you a better indication of our business. Overall, we believe demand will return to this historical trend for us with volumes growing across most categories in the 2% to 3% zone. As part of this growth, we expect to treat COVID patients throughout 2022. We estimate that approximately 3% to 5% of our total admissions will be COVID related. We believe our business will be supported by strong payer mix as a result of stable enrollment in the health insurance exchanges and good job growth across our markets.

Speaker 1

We are also assuming patient acuity continues at high levels. We do expect certain pandemic related governmental reimbursement programs either will not continue or will continue, but at significantly reduced amounts next here. However, we anticipate the reduction of these revenues will be partially offset by certain costs we incurred in treating COVID patients. Clearly, we are operating in a challenging labor environment, which we expect to cause some cost pressures. But at this point in time, We anticipate being able to manage through these challenges or with other inflationary cost pressures.

Speaker 1

In sum, These assumptions lead us to believe that adjusted EBITDA for 2022 will show modest growth over this year's estimated results. Again, we are providing early perspectives and expectations and they could change. The past few years have been a remarkable period For ATA Health Care, we have demonstrated a high level of resiliency and resolve, while at the same time staying true to our mission. Across many dimensions of our business, we have improved our operational and organizational capabilities, which should allow us to provide higher quality care to our patients. I also believe we will emerge on the backside of this event stronger financially and better positioned competitively to grow and drive value for our stakeholders.

Speaker 1

We are investing aggressively in our operating model, which is to develop a comprehensive and conveniently located local network coupled with and supported by An enterprise level system with unique scale and system level capabilities. We believe this model creates competitive advantage, drives market share gains and produces better outcomes for our stakeholders. With that, I'll turn the call over to Bill. Thank you.

Speaker 3

Great. Thank you, Sam, and good morning, everyone. I will discuss our cash flow and capital allocation activity during the quarter, then review Our updated 2021 guidance. Our cash flow from operations was $2,280,000,000 as compared to $2,700,000,000 in the Q3 of 2020. In the prior year, we had received approximately $300,000,000 of stimulus income and deferred approximately $200,000,000 of payroll taxes.

Speaker 3

Capital spending for the quarter was $889,000,000 and we have approximately $3,900,000,000 I've approved capital in the pipeline and is scheduled to come online between now and the end of 2023. We completed just over $2,300,000,000 of share repurchases during the quarter. We have approximately $2,700,000,000 Remaining on our authorization, and we anticipate completing approximately $8,000,000,000 in share repurchases for the full year 2021. Our debt to EBITDA ratio was 2.55 times at the end of the 3rd quarter, Which is the lowest it has been in over 15 years. We had approximately $5,900,000,000 of available liquidity at the end

Speaker 1

of the quarter. Also during

Speaker 3

the quarter, we recorded about $1,000,000,000 gain on sale of facilities related to the sale of 4 hospitals in Georgia and other healthcare We anticipate we will generate approximately $1,500,000,000 of after tax proceeds from our announced divestitures. As noted in our release this morning, we are updating our full year 2021 guidance as follows. We now expect revenues to range between $58,700,000,000

Speaker 2

$59,300,000,000

Speaker 3

We expect full year adjusted EBITDA to range between $12,500,000,000 $12,800,000,000 We expect full year diluted earnings per share range between $17.20 $17.80 And our capital spending target remains at approximately 3,700,000,000 As I conclude my remarks, I think it's important to reflect on the financial condition of the Company as we have navigated the past 20 months of this pandemic. The financial resiliency of HCA Healthcare has been on full display during this time. Our organization has emerged stronger today And before we enter this pandemic, with our leverage ratio well below the low end of our stated range of 3 times, Our available liquidity and our continued strong cash flow generation, we are well positioned as we evaluate capital allocation opportunities Heading in to our planning cycle for 2022. We are focused and committed to delivering long term value for all of our stakeholders. I look forward to sharing more information with you about our outlook in our year end call.

Speaker 3

So with that, I'll turn the call over to Mark to open it

Speaker 2

up for Q and A. All right. Thanks, Sam. Thanks, Bill. Chris, would you give instructions on getting into the queue for questions, please?

Speaker 1

The first question is from Kevin Fishback with Bank of America. Your line is open. Great. Sorry, I had a question Clarification and then a second question. Did you say that 2% to 3% volume growth in total or approximately service lines?

Speaker 1

It sounds like COVID volume might actually be down next year. So, I just want to make sure I was hearing that right. Then, the main question is really about labor costs. It does seem that labor was higher than we thought this quarter. And then Q4 looks like the margin rate did a little bit lower than we thought.

Speaker 1

A little more color on how you're managing labor and what kind of pressure you're seeing there today? I couldn't hear what he said the first question was. Well, the volume.

Speaker 2

When we go 2% to 3% on the volume, Was that all inclusive or just for all service lines?

Speaker 1

Because COVID is down, right? To be down, as I said, we are anticipating 3% to 5% of our total admissions will get COVID related next year. It's about 9% I think for this year, so that we do expect some decline in COVID related. We hope that happens for our communities and so forth. And so when we Estimate, at this particular point in time, we're expecting deposit volumes across the Company as a whole to be up in the 2% to 3% zone.

Speaker 1

Over 2020 and over 2019 is really what it boils down to. Yes. On labor, let me speak to labor. Obviously, in the Q3, we were Dealing with a very intense COVID surge with very sick patients and it was putting a significant strain on our Communities and on our facilities and so forth, and we did what we absolutely had to do as a moral imperative to take care of people. And that required us to Support that volume and that level of acuity with labor and our labor costs did step up in the 3rd quarter.

Speaker 1

We used premium pay where we needed to. We used different levels of shift bonuses and overtime where we needed to. But that was not a question to us. We had a lot of people to take care of and we took care of them appropriately and we still produced I think a very good outcome for the Company with margins at over 21% in the 3rd quarter and actually producing record EBITDA levels. So, labor going forward, we have a multi pronged strategy for managing.

Speaker 1

It starts with expanding our School of Nursing, which we think is going to produce a great pipeline of graduate nurses for our company. We Anticipate approximately 3 times the number of graduates coming out of the Galen School of Nursing over the next few years compared to what we do today. The second thing we're working on is recruitment and retention, and we've added tremendous amount of resources to our recruitment functions. We've advanced our benefits in many areas and we're trying to create an environment where nurses can accomplish what they need to do with our patients and ultimately have an environment where they can be tremendously successful in discharging the responsibilities for our patients And at the same time, more productive in doing just nursing care as opposed to non nursing care. The last thing we're working on that we're very excited about is Care transformation, we think we have opportunities with technology and with new models of care and different levels of support That can change the paradigm in how we deliver care on our floors at our hospitals.

Speaker 1

And we think the combination of all three of these things So, this is in a position where we can manage through the environment that we're facing right now. Obviously, there's some unknowns. We're going to have to work our way through those as they present themselves. But we're pretty confident that the Company is in a reasonable position to manage through the labor environment. Kevin, thank you.

Speaker 1

Chris, next question please. The next question is from Ann Hynes with Mizuho Securities.

Speaker 4

I just want to know how volume tracked by payer mix is commercial still outperforming Medicare and Medicaid And what your expectations are for 2022 when it comes to KNX. And just one follow-up on your comment about cases surgeries being If you look at the chart you provided in the press release, it was about 11.50 versus 2019. Do you think that's all COVID related or is it something else Happening sequentially. Thanks.

Speaker 1

All right, Ann.

Speaker 3

Ann, let me start with the payer mix. Our payer mix, I think, as Sam alluded to in his comments, remains favorable Well, managed care and others growing probably 12% to 15% over the prior year. Our Medicare showed growth, but not quite

Speaker 2

at that level. We were 2%

Speaker 3

to 3% on Medicare. Whether we look at 2019, very similar trends. So, we continue to expect favorable payer mix trends going forward.

Speaker 1

And with respect to labor or not labor, surgery in the Q3, as I mentioned in my comments, we constrained a surgery out of need for other patient care requirements. So we used our surgical staff in many instances to support COVID patients across our facilities. Number 1, we had to use physical space in our recovery rooms at times to take care of people. And so from that standpoint, We did reduce elective share during the quarter at many of our hospitals and we reduced transfers in that typically result in surgeries of some sort In many instances, we do think that that volume will recover as it's recovered in previous periods where we had to do the same thing, 2nd quarter to Q1 as an example. So we anticipate recovery in that.

Speaker 1

And so from that standpoint, we are working our way Through reopening surgery capacity across the Company in an appropriate fashion, and we really don't see any structural issues with our surgical activity across the Company. The next question is from Ryan Tanquilut with Jefferies. Your line is open. Hey, good morning and Congrats to see you guys on the quarter. I guess my question is, as it relates to guidance,

Speaker 3

it's sort of unusual

Speaker 1

So you could see a sequential decline in EBITDA from Q3 to Q4, which is what's implied in the kind of the 2020 guidance. So just Wondering if that's just conservatism. And then as I think about the Slide 2 commentary, 2% to 3% volume, how are you thinking just about margin And with labor in the background, should we expect flat margins to translate to, I guess, 2% or 3% EBITDA growth rate as well?

Speaker 3

Brian? Yes. Brian, let me start with the Q4 guidance. We think our range provides some level of growth and we recognize that midpoint is on, there's still a lot of variables at play. We continue to manage the Company as we can to continue to drive growth.

Speaker 3

We've had very few normal months to project from. Again, I think our range is appropriate at this level. It's roughly a $350,000,000 Ray is at the midpoint compared to our previous guidance. So again, I think it's appropriate from how we read it right now.

Speaker 2

Margin, maybe that's also about the margins.

Speaker 3

Well, there's a lot of variables that are playing the margins for next year. As we Include our planning, we'll talk to you further about those. But I think we have a history to continue to drive reasonable margins going forward and that's our

Speaker 1

Our next question is from Justin Lake with Wolfe Research. Your line is

Speaker 5

open. Thanks. Couple of things here. Just one wanted to clarify. When you say modest, is it fair to get to lower single digits there kind of the jump off point for 2022?

Speaker 5

And then my question is on labor. Can you give us a little color on 2 things? One, any kind of help on the maybe the dollar amount and the percentage kind of temporary labor, Travel Lane, you said you're kind of running. If given a certain cost, which is great on the revenue side, or I should say, cost might as well. And then, Can you walk us through kind of how your labor costs are run through the year in terms of maybe what percentage Your labor kind of the SG price increases quarterly?

Speaker 5

I know it's not all, just oneone. Thanks.

Speaker 2

We've just got 3 questions in on one call, Bubba.

Speaker 3

Hey, Justin, this is Bill. Let me start with kind of 'twenty two. Our intention was to provide some broad commentary and I'll fully raise going in a lot of details. But as we've mentioned throughout the course of the year, we know we've received some COVID support from the DRG add on payments, HRSA payments for uninsured COVID payments as well as the delay of sequestration cuts. These programs, it's about $625,000,000 year to date.

Speaker 3

That could reach close to $750,000,000 to $800,000,000 for the full year. We don't have full line of sight now on what to expect for these programs going forward. Hope to have some clearer assessment of these as we Complete the planning process, but for now, we're not really expecting those to continue to benefit going into 2022. However, we also have some COVID related costs this year that we don't expect to continue going forward, supply related costs, cost of screeners and alive. So, our broad thinking now is we should reasonably expect to be able to generate our historical growth rate 5% to 6% after netting out these amounts.

Speaker 3

And that is what the result will result in some modest growth year over year on an as recorded basis. So that was kind of our broad thinking right now. We'll firm that up as we go through our planning cycle. But that was The intention of our commentary is to show

Speaker 1

that we still see some growth going forward in 2022. And with respect to labor, Again, we used whatever labor we could find to take care of record census that the Company was experiencing with the delta variant surge. So we used contract labor over time, again, bonuses for our full time staff, whatever it took That obviously trends down naturally as we have a less COVID census. We've had that pattern in the Q4 of last year and the Q1 of this year, and we expect that pattern to continue. As it relates to the wage rates and the changes that we have, they vary across the company.

Speaker 1

Generally speaking, They're mostly in the Q2 and Q3. So that's part of the natural trend that we see inside of our labor costs As we move through the course of the year, one thing and Bill was alluding to this, typically we have 4th quarter seasonality that Generates more activity in the Q4 than we have in the Q3. We don't have a baseline 3rd quarter To judge seasonality right now, that's part of the challenge that we've got. But I think the Company has proven that it can manage in a surge Very effectively, it produced really solid margins. And then in a reboot, like we did in the 2nd quarter, managed through that Transition in a very effective way.

Speaker 1

So, I fully anticipate that our teams will be able to navigate through The back part of the Q3, into the Q4 and on into next year and hopefully a reboot mode in a way that ultimately produces success for the Company.

Speaker 2

Yes. And thank you for

Speaker 1

the question. The next question is from Scott Fidel with Stephens. Your line is open. Okay. Good morning.

Speaker 1

I'm just wondering if you could talk a bit about what you're seeing

Operator

in Medicaid volumes. And just It seems like Medicaid volumes have continued

Speaker 1

to trend relatively low in terms of the overall mix, even though Medicaid enrollments are just up so much because of the connection of the recent foundation. So Just interested in your perspective on what you're thinking around that aspect in terms of the lower Medicaid falls relative to be increases in Medicare. Great. Thanks, Scott.

Speaker 2

Yes, Scott. I'll try. We did see Medicaid growth when

Speaker 1

I look at 21 1 versus 20%

Speaker 2

of almost 9%. I don't have at my fingertips what Medicaid enrollment has done in our states. So, I don't have that as

Speaker 3

a relative base. But, we have seen Medicaid growth in this quarter at least year to date. We're tracking at about 7%. So, Perhaps that does track with enrollment going forward as well.

Speaker 1

The next question is from Ralph Begbie. Your line is open.

Operator

I guess, first, You gave and I know you want to sort of hold off on top of that. You gave us the volume of 2% to 3%, hoping you could give Some sense on how you see the potential CapEx developing next year? And then specifically, just on the equity mix. Obviously, another strong quarter there. Is there any way to Exclude Coveout and give us a sense of what that is sort of either year over year relative to 2019?

Speaker 2

Hey, Rob. Thanks. Well, as

Speaker 1

I said this is Sam. We do anticipate that acuity levels We'll be strong as we move forward into 2022. Our COVID our non COVID acuity levels the year have been up compared to 2019. And so we have seen a natural lift in acuity. Part of that is strategic, part of that is Some migration into outpatient.

Speaker 1

And part of that is just sort of the environment that we're in, We believe so we anticipate that acuity levels will remain strong. I don't know that we've assigned a metric to it at this particular point in time. If you look at our non COVID activity for the year as a whole, it is up compared to 2019. And so, we anticipate that at this particular juncture continuing into 2022.

Speaker 2

All right. Thank you, Ralph.

Speaker 1

Our next question is from Frank Morgan with RBC Capital Markets. Your line is open. Good morning. Just curious on the surgery side, any additional color you could Provide to us on a regional basis between in and outpatient and freestanding surgical volumes and where you saw the biggest impact for COVID? Thanks.

Speaker 1

Our inpatient surgeries were the only metric, again, as I mentioned in my comments, that were down for the quarter and that's because we used a lot of the space that was necessary for COVID patients, our outpatient activity was up. It was up 7%. It was up more in our freestanding ASCs than it was in our hospitals, but both were And then when you look at it against 2019, I think again, we had growth with the exception of Inpatient surgeries, Frank. And that again is a direct correlation to the fact that we needed that space for COVID in patients in order to manage our capacity from both staffing and a bed standpoint. Got you.

Speaker 1

And just in the just from a geographic standpoint on the outpatient side, did you notice any more of an effect in, say, the Texas and Florida markets of, Is outpatient because of COVID? Thanks. I don't have all of it in front of me. Obviously, Florida and Texas, We're very intense geographies for us with the delta variant. And so, it's reasonable to assume that that's where we had more pressure in those markets than we did in other parts of the country.

Speaker 1

But that would be my reaction to that question. Great.

Speaker 2

All right, Frank. Thank you so much.

Speaker 1

Thank you. Our next question is from Pito Chickering with Deutsche Bank. Your line is open. Hey, good morning guys. Thanks for taking my questions.

Speaker 1

For your 2022 revenue commentary, you talked about the high the high machine procedures continuing. Just curious sort of What is fueling that? What areas are driving that? Is it cardio recovering, orthopedics, etcetera? And then as I think about 2022 beyond, Just a question for you.

Speaker 1

Once you get over sort of the noise from COVID, does long term growth That you've played out in the past, does it concern you from these levels once you get through the noise of Q1? Thanks so much. Thanks, Frida. Our belief is that demand for healthcare services is still strong. We think it's going to be 1 point When you look out into the intermediate run and so forth, and we think for HCA, we have a differentiated portfolio of markets and we have strong economies underneath that differentiated portfolio where population growth, job growth and so forth Bob, it's existent.

Speaker 1

And then we've had this pattern and we think this pattern can continue of market share gains. And as we look at where we are today versus where we were heading into 2020, we think we've improved our overall positioning competitively with Broader networks, more physicians, better clinical outcomes and so forth. And we will continue to Resource our model and we think that model still has growth embedded in it because of these factors. We're not ready to give any particular guidance as it relates to out years. But we do think the Company's approach It can still yield successful returns for our shareholders.

Speaker 1

Next question is from Guimara Kehoe with SVB Leerink. Your line is open. Hey, thanks. If I had to reflect back on your commentary a year ago, Sam, you referenced a lot of, I guess, we'll call it emerging Opportunities, I sort of think the ability to align closer to certain medical groups comes to mind. It might just be helpful to hear How some of these opportunities have evolved over the last 18 months?

Speaker 1

And maybe I mean this in the context of market share shifts, etcetera. Just any high level observations or thoughts would be helpful. Thanks. Thank you, Whit. Well, let me start with the fact that our most recent market share data that we have, which is late last year, 2020 or 1st part of this year, I don't remember the exact period, Shows us at the high watermarks.

Speaker 1

We picked up market share in 2020 when I look at just sort of what happened in that year. So, I'll start with that. Additionally, we have added to our network. We have added in some cases a few hospitals here and there, whether it's new hospitals that have opened We've had small acquisitions of hospitals to round out our network offering. But in particular, on the outpatient side, we've added A reasonable number of new facilities, whether it's new urgent care center platform, new freestanding emergency rooms, some ambulatory surgery.

Speaker 1

And then we've added to our physician platform over the last 18 months, some of which has been development of existing practices in our communities, but also new practice acquisitions that have added to our offerings. I think our outpatient Facility capabilities up to about 2,200 outpatient facilities. At the end of 2019, it was just a little north of 2,000, so we continue to add capabilities and convenience for our patients, again, creating a broader Network offering in these communities. We have done some acquisitions, the pipeline as it relates to outpatient Acquisitions is strong. Also, our development pipeline of new outpatient facilities It is robust and we fueled that with investments.

Speaker 1

And then as Bill indicates, we have a strong pipeline of projects That will come online in 20222023 that are connected to both our hospital platform as well as our outpatient platform. So we see again the model, the flywheel, if you will, of HCA continuing to produce solid results and deliver value to our patients and value to our shareholders. Thank you, Gwen. The next question is from Lance Wilkes with Bernstein. Your line is open.

Speaker 5

Yes. I just wanted to follow-up on the capital deployment team. And And if you could talk a little bit about what you're looking at as far as enterprise assets that's at the top The local markets and in particular earlier in the year you were talking about the Flywheel concepts and looking at Digital or virtual assets or other assets that might feed into it. So, just interesting if you've had any evolution and thought as to what you're going to be focused on there? And then, Any progress reports on that?

Speaker 5

Thanks.

Speaker 1

We do see complementary opportunities to use digital capabilities more effectively in our company. As I've mentioned on previous calls, advancing technology and our organization There's a tremendous opportunity to improve care, support our physicians and nurses with decision making capabilities as well as A more space environment. We also see with that more consistency and transparency, which we believe can produce More efficiencies as we go through it. So we've got a number of initiatives that are connected to that. In addition to that component, We are using telemedicine to support outreach to our patient population and meet them where they want to be.

Speaker 1

And there we see opportunities for telemedicine to Support what goes on inside of our facilities and preserve better care for our patients by helping our physicians and our nurses with really extended capabilities that can come from telemedicine inside the walls of our hospitals. So those areas are progressing. They're showing early signs of value in some instances. And then when they connect with our Care Transformation agenda, Dean led by one of our physicians and his team were very excited about what that potentially yields in the form of better care, More efficient care and so forth. So we have a number of initiatives underway.

Speaker 1

They're not completely implemented across the Company because we're still studying What are the best approaches? We're pretty excited about what this agenda can do for our organization. All right. Thanks, Elias. Our next question is from Jamie Kearst with Goldman Sachs.

Speaker 1

Your line is open.

Operator

Hey, good morning, guys. Thanks Early in the pandemic, you outlined a couple different stages of cost opportunities that you were thinking about. How are those tracking and how much more of the base cost Can you optimize and are those enough to offset some of the incremental wage pressures you're dealing with and other inflationary pressures out there?

Speaker 3

This is Bill. Thanks for the question. As we have talked before, we have resiliency efforts underway. We started last year. Those efforts continue.

Speaker 3

We have some of those efforts that are implemented and we're realizing the benefits now and we have some of those efforts that are still in the early We do expect some of those areas to help offset some of the inflationary increases we might see. These efforts are centered around utilizing our scale where we have the ability to consolidate and standardize Functions that may be distributed right now. We're also looking at some structural changes in terms of how we support our field based operations. So we have a number of efforts underway. Some of them are at the completion stage and the benefits are being realized as we speak.

Speaker 3

And some of them still are in the early stages that will provide benefit going forward. So it's an important part of our activity level right now. We have teams focused On a variety of efforts and we have a certain governance structure

Speaker 1

in place to make sure that

Speaker 3

we get executed timely. So, they will continue going forward.

Speaker 1

The next question is from E. J. Rice with Credit Suisse. Your line is open. Thanks.

Speaker 1

Hi, everybody. And Mark, I don't know if we're going to have you on the

Speaker 3

Q4 call. So, I just would say congratulations on your retirement and best wishes.

Speaker 1

I want to ask about the capital deployment a little further. Obviously, this year, you did $6,000,000,000 You've done $6,000,000,000 of share repurchases. When you think about capital deployment going forward, what kind of pace do you think is reasonable for that? And I know you've already announced Salt Lake City deal, so on the side of coming out of the pandemic, hospital assets or other more significant assets that might be available, Can you talk about that pipeline? And specifically with Salt Lake, when you made your comments, Bill, about next year's growth, I'm assuming until that deal closes, you're not Incorporating that in your commentary, my understanding is $190,000,000 to $100,000,000 of EBITDA?

Speaker 1

Yes.

Speaker 5

A. J, you are We

Speaker 3

are not incorporating anything into that into our commentary at this point in time. To the capital allocation, let me step back and I'll talk a little broadly about that. As I mentioned in my comments, we are in a very strong position as we approach our capital Allocation decisions for next year given our cash flow generation, the balance sheet position and liquidity we're carrying, As we've described it in the past, we're really focused on what I described as a balanced approach to capital. And our first priority is evaluating opportunities to Capital in our markets to capture growth through our internal capital program. We haven't finalized on that range yet, but I would anticipate we'll increase the With the opportunity, as we mentioned in our guidance, it should be somewhere around $3,700,000,000 this year, maybe a little below that.

Speaker 3

Prior to the pandemic, we were at $4,000,000,000 to $4,200,000,000 And so we're evaluating where that should settle for next year, but we think that will be an important part of the Continuing to grow. After that, it's a matter of how best to utilize our free cash flow to drive value. A dividend program and share repurchase program, we expect to continue to be an important part of our overall capital allocation process. We haven't finalized that, but we have ample capital capacity to give any consideration to both of those programs. And I would expect them to be part of our balanced portfolio of capital going forward.

Speaker 1

The next question is from John Ransom with Raymond James. Your line is open.

Operator

Hey, good morning. I'd add my

Speaker 3

best wishes to Mr. Kim Ho. He's not leaving yet. I've been on him for a little while.

Operator

Thinking about Q4 in conjunction with your guidance, I mean, your labor costs, you talked about it a lot, but they jumped up About 11% kind of hanging in the $640,000,000 range for 3 quarters. If we think about the Q4, let's say COVID drops from It drops by 5%, 6%, some of that pressure comes off. Isn't it reasonable to think that the labor costs Yes. To get a little bit of a

Speaker 3

breather sequentially just relative to less acute pressure from what we felt the Delta wave in the Q3 of August.

Speaker 2

Hi, John. This is Bill.

Speaker 1

I think as Sam mentioned

Speaker 3

in his earlier commentary, we've this quarter was affected by having and gaining the labor Anyway we could to support the volume we were seeing. And as COVID does subside, we expect those premium programs that we implemented During the quarter, just subside. And then whether it be utilization of the contract labor, looking at the overtime as well as some of these bonus Shift differentials that we have to pay. So we do expect that to come down relative to where we had in Q3, but we understand there's still So, this is a follow-up. So, if

Operator

you think about less potential revenue and Less acute pressure from labor, wouldn't that imply EBITDA going up sequentially, not being flat?

Speaker 3

Yes. I understand that question. As we said before, historically, we see some seasonality. We don't know what the seasonality change will be. We think our range provides the opportunity for us to grow at the top end of that.

Speaker 3

So again, I think just given the environment we're seeing, we Recruitment and

Speaker 1

The next question is from Joshua Raskin with Nephron Serge, your line is open.

Operator

Thanks and good morning. I'm going to hold my comments on Martin, I guess, for another 90 days to be down for you. My question is on value based care. From the perspective

Speaker 1

of HCA, it's the largest hospital operator in the country, one of the largest So do you look at this movement, and I want to see if you feel like it's been felt much, just The opportunities for HCA on the hospital side to benefit from value based care contracts. And then, do you think about opportunities for your completion base because

Operator

I know there's a kind of conversation around enabling providers at this point?

Speaker 1

We have certain aspects of value based care embedded in obviously Medicare reimbursement. In some of our commercial contracts, we have aspects of value based care component Part of our reimbursement methodology. So that will continue, I think, into the future. Is it accelerating in our facility structures? No.

Speaker 1

Inside of our physician platform, we do see opportunities to continue to push further into value based care. Again, in that particular platform in our Company, we have aspects of value based care. They vary a little bit from one market to the other depending on the circumstances, the demographics and payer dynamics in those markets. So we do see it growing more in the physician platform than on the facility side I would submit. But I think if you pull up and you look at our relationships across the organization in the payer environment, they're very strong.

Speaker 1

We're 80, 85 percent contracted for 2022. We're about 50% contracted for 2023 on terms that work for both organizations. They continue a lot of the structure that's already in place. And we evolve as we renew With what's going on in the marketplace, we are in most commercial contracts in just about every market where we do business and in most Medicare Advantage relationships as well. So that's a key part of our approach and that's why it's important for our model Within each of the markets to be comprehensive, both in outpatient offerings, convenient for the patients and then Having different price points for the payers, but ultimately creating a full system that can offer solutions And we adjust those solutions to fit the situation with each payer.

Speaker 1

And some of that again can be value based, Some of it can be different approaches to other reimbursement terms. We think we're striking the right balance in how we approach that. The next question is from Jerry Taylor with Cowen. Your line is open.

Operator

Hey, good morning, guys. Congrats on the quarter. I know it was a bit difficult to manage through and The Street Toy is immediately looking for the next data point, maybe not enough credit given the net debt due, so good job on the quarter. I wanted to ask, I think this primarily goes to Bill. When we look at So where your margins were trending a few years pre pandemic, a couple of 100 basis points.

Operator

I think your guidance for next year inherently assumes margins come back to some degree. We understand all the factors That have been driving it, the higher occupancies, better mix, the higher acuity, despite COVID costs, despite the labor costs, etcetera. Bill, I feel like a year or so ago, you saw some opportunities to take some real sort of permanent efficiencies Out of the cost structure, I just wanted to get your thoughts now as we sort of head into 'twenty two and beyond, Should investors think that margins ultimately could go right back to the low 19s? Or are there good reasons structurally that Maybe you can sustain somewhere in the middle.

Speaker 3

Well, Darren, one thanks. It is a very good question. Sure. We are focused on driving as much efficiency as we can throughout the organization. I think we have a pretty good track record of doing that.

Speaker 3

You're right. If you go pre pandemic, we were hovering 19% margins or a couple of quarters would be 20%. We've changed that. Some of that is due to the mix From there, our focus will be to continue to drive margins. We have been supported by a couple of those COVID support programs that I spoke about.

Speaker 3

We fully anticipate once we account for those that we should maintain and find some incremental growth to margins going forward. And all of our efforts, including our

Speaker 1

resiliency plans and our

Speaker 3

day to day management is to Continue to drive efficiencies, utilize the scale of the organization to bring benefits. So, I do believe that once we get Into a normalized kind of post COVID surge environment and we compare our current margins to where they were pre pandemic, you'll see some elevation in there.

Speaker 1

Thank you, Terry. When you look at the Terry, this is Sam. When you look at the Q3 of 2019, We cleared almost what I call 36 First, Ben, keep it off here. So in other words, our margins found in 2021 against 2019 We're 2x what the average margin was in 2019. And so, obviously, It's significant compared to that same period then.

Speaker 1

And we do see some structural pieces that Phil was alluding Obviously, there is a potential of inflation that we have to figure out exactly what the implications of that are, and we think some of our strategies will mitigate it. But we have been able to reposition the profitability of the Company and we're pushing to try to sustain those gains as much as we possibly can. Thank you, Gary. The next question is from Andrew Mok with UBS Financial. Your line is open.

Speaker 1

Hi, good morning. First, one clarification and then I'll take my question. Bill, earlier, I think you said 5% to 6 percent core EBITDA growth of the earnings base ex government aid. If so, it sounds like you actually expect accelerating growth in compared to the long term growth target of 4% to 6%. Is that fair?

Speaker 3

Well, We've had long term 4% to 6%. I think if you look at our actual historical, we'd be more in that 5% to 6%. So again, we're in early stages and the intent was give you some broad commentary versus specifics on there. So that was how the commentary was structured.

Speaker 1

Got it. And then just a follow-up on the de novo deployment. I think you have at least 20 to 30 de novos underway between ambulatory surgery and inpatient rehab.

Speaker 3

You give us a sense for

Speaker 1

the cadence of when those facilities come online and the expected profit ramp in those facilities over the next 18 months? I don't have we have a pipeline of urgent care that I know is Online in 2022 or 2023, again through acquisition or de novo development. We have maybe 10 or 12 ambulatory surgery centers, some of which come online in the 4th quarter, Most come online in 2022 of that particular component. And then we have some other outpatient facilities that Maybe 15 or so in those categories come online in 'twenty two with another 15 or so in 'twenty three. We have a lot in different categories coming online and that's part of the continued addition to our 2,200 outpatient facilities.

Speaker 1

And so I don't have the earnings expectations around those or a composite on each all of them in total. We but we do have a pretty active development. And those are complementary and there's a national ramp In Aetna as well. And for the most part, we're really bullish on the prospects for those outpatient facilities. There are no further questions.

Speaker 1

At this time, I'll turn call over to Mr. Kimbrell for any closing remarks.

Speaker 2

All right. Chris, thank you so much for your help today. Thanks, everyone, for joining our call. Hope you have a wonderful weekend. I'm around this afternoon and I can answer any additional questions you might have.

Speaker 2

Take care.

Speaker 1

Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating and you may now disconnect.

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Earnings Conference Call
HCA Healthcare Q3 2021
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