Echostar Q2 2026 Earnings Report

Echostar EPS Results

• Actual EPS: $24.12
• Consensus EPS: -$0.02
• Beat/Miss: Beat by +$24.14
• One Year Ago EPS: -$1.06

Echostar Revenue Results

• Actual Revenue: $3.58 billion
• Expected Revenue: $3.59 billion
• Beat/Miss: Missed by -$10.67 million
• YoY Revenue Growth: -4.00%

Echostar Announcement Details

• Quarter: Q2 2026
• Date: 8/7/2026
• Time: Before Market Opens
• Conference Call Date: Monday, August 3, 2026
• Conference Call Time: 12:00PM ET

Echostar (NASDAQ:ECHO)oration is a communications company that provides satellite and wireless services, video distribution, and broadband connectivity solutions. Its business has historically been centered on satellite technology and related services, serving customers through a range of connectivity and network offerings.

The company operates through several segments that support pay-TV, enterprise, government, and consumer communications needs. Its services and technologies have included satellite television distribution, broadband satellite access, network infrastructure, and wireless communications capabilities.

EchoStar was founded in 1980 and has long been associated with satellite communications in the United States. The company serves customers in the U.S. and other markets through its various communications and technology businesses.

Echostar Q2 2026 Earnings Call Transcript

Key Takeaways

• Negative Sentiment: Hughes filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy after failing to reach an agreement with bondholders ahead of its $1.5 billion maturity. EchoStar said the filing is limited to Hughes entities and that operations, employee payments, customer service, and vendor commitments are expected to continue normally, but the restructuring timeline remains uncertain.
• Positive Sentiment: Following the AT&T transaction, EchoStar said it has approximately $14 billion-$15 billion in cash, 261.8 million SpaceX shares, and about $5 billion of debt expected to be repaid when the SpaceX transaction closes. Management characterized the company, excluding Hughes, as becoming cash-rich with relatively little debt.
• Negative Sentiment: EchoStar continues to estimate $5 billion-$7 billion in liabilities related to wireless network shutdown costs and taxes associated with the SpaceX transactions. The estimate remains subject to litigation, valuation changes, and potential tax strategies such as Section 1033 exchanges.
• Neutral Sentiment: The board increased the share-repurchase authorization to $5 billion, but management said bond covenants currently restrict buybacks and emphasized that capital will first be considered for core businesses and other investments. EchoStar also said it will remain cautious about acquisitions while valuations are elevated.
• Negative Sentiment: Boost Mobile was slightly cash-positive during the quarter but continued to lose subscribers, and management acknowledged it has not yet “cracked the code” for the wireless business. New leadership is pursuing strategic initiatives, while EchoStar remains open to partnerships, M&A, or a potential DBS combination with DirecTV.

Presentation

[Operator]

Greetings, and welcome to the EchoStar Corporation Q2 2026 Earnings Conference Call. At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. A question-and-answer session will follow a formal presentation. If anyone should require operator assistance, please press star zero on your telephone keypad. As a reminder, this conference is being recorded.

[Operator]

It is now my pleasure to introduce Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary. Thank you. You may begin.

[Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary at EchoStar]

Good afternoon. I'm here with Charlie Ergen, Paul Orban, our CFO, and John Swieringa, our COO. We will begin with opening remarks from Charlie, followed by a question-and-answer session. We ask that any participant producing a report not identify other participants or their firms in such reports. We also do not allow audio recordings. All statements we make during this call, other than statements of historical fact, constitute forward-looking statements made pursuant to the safe harbor provided by the Securities Reform Act of 1995. These forward-looking statements involve known and unknown risks, uncertainties, and other factors that could cause our actual results to be materially different from historical results and from any future results expressed or implied by the forward-looking statements.

[Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary at EchoStar]

For a list of those factors and risks, please refer to our annual report on Form 10-K for the fiscal year ended December 31st, 2025, our 10-Q filed today, and our subsequent filings made with the SEC. This information and supplemental materials relating to today's call will be posted on our investor relations website. All cautionary statements we make during the call should be understood as being applicable to any forward-looking statements we make wherever they appear. You should carefully consider the risks described in our reports and should not place any undue reliance on any forward-looking statements. We assume no responsibility for updating any forward-looking statements.

[Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary at EchoStar]

We refer to OIBDA and free cash flow during this call. The comparable GAAP measure and our reconciliation for OIBDA is presented in our earnings release and, in the case of free cash flow, in our Form 10-Q, as filed today with the SEC.

[Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary at EchoStar]

With that, I'll turn it over to Charlie.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Thank you, Jeff. We're just going to take questions, but before we take questions, I just want to give a few opening comments. As you all know, August 1st, we had a $1.5 billion bond maturity for Hughes Corporation. We had discussions with the bondholders but weren't able to come up with a workable solution. We filed Chapter 11 bankruptcy this morning for Hughes. I want to make just a couple points on that. One is, this filing is strictly limited to the Hughes entities. It does not include EchoStar Corporation, our other non-Hughes subsidiaries, or even Hughes international entities.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Second, we have first-day motions this afternoon in front of the court to ensure that Hughes continues to operate the normal course of business, and that means we're paying our employees, we're delivering for customers and channel partners as usual, and we expect to fulfill all ongoing forward commitments to our vendors. Third, we don't know how long bankruptcy will take before we can emerge restructured. As a result of the litigation that is expected in this, we won't take questions on Hughes, but I would refer you, and you are referred in our press release, there's a link to our filing that I think lays out chapter and verse the details there.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

With that, we'll take questions.

[Operator]

Thank you. At this time, we will conduct the question-and-answer session. If you would like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad. A confirmation tone will indicate that your line is in the question queue. You may press star two if you would like to remove your question from the queue. For participants using speaker equipment, it may be necessary to pick up your handset before pressing the star keys. Your first question comes from David Barden with New Street Research. Please state your question.

[David Barden, Partner at New Street Research]

Hey, guys. Thanks so much for taking the questions. I guess I wanted to start with Charlie. No one probably knows better than you the discount to which EchoStar trades to its remaining portfolio of assets and SpaceX. Now that you've got the AT&T money, it would seem a logical thing to start buying back stock. If not, why not? What would be the priority for that capital next? Thank you.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Yeah. Thanks, Dave, for the question. First of all, you will see in the 10-K, 10-Q, I guess, that we did increase the authorization. The board increased the authorization up to $5 billion of buyback. Obviously, one of the things that we look at based on our capital structure is one of the things we look at, I would say first and foremost, we look at investing in our business. We'd look at our existing businesses to invest in and the opportunities there. EchoStar Capital, now under the leadership of Tom Cullen, we look at other things we can look at, which could include our own company. After that, if we can't find anything there, you could work all the way down to paying dividends.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

We've been a good steward of capital for a lot of years, and I hope we'll continue to do that.

[David Barden, Partner at New Street Research]

Appreciate that, Charlie. Thank you.

[Operator]

Your next question comes from Brent Penter with Raymond James. Please state your question.

[Brent Penter, Equity Research Analyst at Raymond James]

Hey guys, thanks for taking the questions. A couple from me. First, I want to follow up on David's question. You mentioned EchoStar Capital, and that was folded under the corporate development arm. Does that represent any change in philosophy about how you're investing at EchoStar Capital and any change to the list of kind of opportunities you gave back in November last year?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Yeah, Brent. No, really no change other than it's probably a little bit more efficient since we're done under one roof and probably move a little bit faster just because we're literally in the same area in the company. Obviously, Tom comes with wealth of experience of long-term in the industry, not just at EchoStar.

[Brent Penter, Equity Research Analyst at Raymond James]

Okay. Got it. On the SpaceX transactions, given where the SpaceX market cap is today compared to the $400 billion valuation it was when you signed the deals, the implied value is obviously much higher. How do you size the expected tax payment today? Are you doing any hedging on that, or have you all had any discussions with SpaceX about alternative ways that you could structure those deals to reduce or delay those taxes?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Yeah. Brent, those are all good questions. I guess the way I try to answer your question is we still are of mind that the cost of finalizing the termination of our wireless network and our tax liability is in that $5 billion-$7 billion range. We don't know the answer on where we're going to be there. It could be a little higher, a little lower than that. Obviously, there's litigation on the termination of the network. Obviously, we don't know where SpaceX will be in the future, and we know that there's things like 1033 exchanges and things that can reduce tax liability.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

We're in that $5 billion-$7 billion range in terms of what we think it's going to be, but that includes our wireless network termination. We're a good steward of capital, so we're looking at everything, and how we can make sure that we take care of capital the best way.

[Brent Penter, Equity Research Analyst at Raymond James]

Okay. Got it. How are you all thinking about Boost Mobile strategically? If you wanted to engage in any kind of M&A or partnerships in that business, how restrictive are the NSA and MNSA contracts with T-Mobile and AT&T and changing control provisions there?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Well, I can't get into the actual contracts. I talk about Boost in general. One is, as management, we haven't cracked the code on how to be successful to the level we'd like to in the wireless business. In general, we've treaded water for four years now. We were slightly cash positive in the quarter, but we did lose subscribers. Having said that, we have new leadership with Bob Rupczynski, who joined us four or five months ago, and he's certainly taken a fresh approach. We think we have some strategic initiatives going forward that will reinvigorate that part of our business. In general, all of our businesses have to run at a profit, long term. They have to have a right to exist, because everybody's only as good as their last quarter.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

We like the business. We're disappointed that we haven't done better in it. It's a great challenge for us, but it's strategically important for us, we do have a fair amount of flexibility contractually to whether it be M&A or partnering with people and we'll continue to see if we can figure out how to be productive there.

[Brent Penter, Equity Research Analyst at Raymond James]

All right. Great. Thanks, Charlie.

[Operator]

Your next question comes from Sebastiano Petti with JPMorgan. Please state your question.

[Sebastiano Petti, Senior Research Analyst at JPMorgan]

Hi, thanks for taking the question. Charlie, maybe going back to David Barden's question, why increase the buyback from $2 billion-$3 billion, but yet be out of the market? Is there anything that is precluding EchoStar from buying back stock currently in the market? Maybe just a follow-up, thinking about the remaining assets, particularly AWS-3, how are you thinking about that now on the other side of the auction, and perhaps maybe timeline? Would there be any debt that would need to be paid off from the sale of AWS-3 spectrum at this point? Thank you.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

We do have some restrictions on buying back stock in our bond indentures. I don't know how public those are, but we do have some restrictions. Sebastiano, the way I'd look at EchoStar, or the way I look at it, or I think the way we look at it is that Having closed the AT&T transaction, and putting $2.4 billion into an escrow for Boost for the closing down of our network as mandated by the FCC. Put that $2.4 billion aside. You look at the total company, we have about $14 billion or $15 billion in cash. We have that $5 billion-$7 billion liability, in our opinion, going forward, which includes the $2.4 billion. We have Boost, which is certainly a valuable company or potentially a valuable company.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Our traditional video business, which continues to throw off cash. In addition to that, we have 261.8 million shares of SpaceX, and obviously you can figure out at least publicly what the value of that is. We have still a solid spectrum position of AWS-3, CBRS, 700 MHz, et cetera, that you could take a stab at in terms of valuation. Excluding Hughes, which is obviously in the restructuring process today and which will ultimately get sorted out, we have about $5 billion of debt that SpaceX transaction will pay at closing. We have $1.9 billion of convert debt that at this point is in the money with convert. You end up with a company that's cash rich, not much debt.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

We're pretty easy to look at the value and obviously the conglomerate discount that people give to the marketplace or the lack of confidence in management or whatever the discount rate is. That's how you value the company. Going forward, we're going to, as we always have, look for opportunity, and manage the business in a respectable fashion. This year is interesting because unfortunately, a lot of focus is really just cleaning up the network shutdown, and cleaning some of that up through the courts just because we had no other choice but to do that. Getting in the position to focus our company on moving forward with all the opportunities that we have.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

In addition to that pivot to an asset, a cash-rich company, every company's going through the pivot to AI and how it affects your business, and our company wasn't built for AI. We didn't know anything about it years ago. We have to pivot, and in a funny sort of way, there's a restructuring going on within EchoStar to say, how do we take advantage of that paradigm shift of how AI changes businesses and the way businesses operate. I think a lot of our success in the future will be dependent on how well we do with that, and it's certainly way too early to tell how we're going to do with that. Culturally, our team's excited about it and very focused on it.

[Sebastiano Petti, Senior Research Analyst at JPMorgan]

Thanks.

[Operator]

Your next question comes from Walter Piecyk with LightShed. Please state your question.

[Walter Piecyk, Partner and TMT Analyst at LightShed]

Thanks. Just a question on the DBS prepackaged proceedings. I know bidders could still obviously potentially emerge during this process, but assuming that you end up being the kind of stalking horse bidder and the winner of those assets, just thoughts on what you do with the radios. Has there been any appetite in the market for the redeployment of those radios for a wholesale fourth network? Any other assets that you might end up effectively still owning at the end of that reorg?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Walt, it'd be way premature to speculate on that. You can see our stalking horse bid, I think, was potentially $300 million, somewhat less than that because of cash on hand. You can hypothesize that, at least in our opinion, there's not a lot of liquidation value there. I think it's relatively immaterial in the scheme of things when you look at the other assets that we have.

[Walter Piecyk, Partner and TMT Analyst at LightShed]

Got it.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Walt, if I could cut you off there. I think the more important thing, the way I would look at it, is we're a unique company in the sense that we have mobility through Boost. We have a lot of broadband relationships, not the least of which is through SpaceX. We have video. We know connectivity pretty well, and connectivity is going to take a lot of different shapes for customers, but most customers are going to need Wi-Fi, broadband, whether that be through a cable or satellite, maybe some people with both. People still have video needs. We're uniquely positioned to do that. Because it looks to me like in terms of an actual network, the big three network have done a good job of building a pretty big moat around their businesses.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

We kind of play with one foot in that business as well. The real key is the knowledge base we have, the fact that we play in a lot of different places in the connectivity field, I think will be helpful for us going forward. We have to prove it, of course.

[Walter Piecyk, Partner and TMT Analyst at LightShed]

You bid also in the re-auction of the DE stuff. Do you have plans to bid in the upcoming C-band auction? Does any deal that you have with the FCC, where obviously you've committed to sell your existing spectrum, does that prohibit you from bidding in upcoming auctions or even secondary market transactions for spectrum?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

The auction rules aren't out for the C-band auction, but we would anticipate that we would not be prevented from participating. We've participated, I think, in every auction since the first one. Actually, the first one was a satellite auction we participated, but the first terrestrial one we did not participate in, but we participated in ones after that. I don't think we'll be prevented. Whether it would make any sense for us to participate, given where we are, that's a whole different question, and we certainly haven't analyzed that. Secondary market transactions, if there was something that we thought was strategic important that would enhance the value of our company, we would look at it.

[Walter Piecyk, Partner and TMT Analyst at LightShed]

Just one last question. This EchoStar Capital, the last time this topic was discussed, I think the way Hamid at the time had answered it, made it seem like the top priority was finding new investments and taking all this capital that you're getting from the spectrum sales and finding new stuff. It sounds a little different in terms of the tone, where you're saying, obviously, invest in what you already have, right? Then share repurchase and dividends. I know it was mentioned kind of new initiatives, but is that kind of deprioritized in terms of the use of capital when all this cash starts flowing in from the spectrum sales?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Yeah. No, I think I would say it a different way. I think obviously investing in our core businesses today where we have opportunities. The second thing we'd look at is the opportunities that Hamid has already identified. He identified quite a few, and quite a few relationships, some of which we already had. I think we would look at returns there. Then as part of that, as a subset of that, you would look at your own company, right? It just depends on how you would evaluate those opportunities. I guess I'd say a cautionary note, we're going to be patient. I mean, the market is pretty frothy. We're not going to rush out to do something and overpay for something just because we have money.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

I can only tell you from playing poker, you can win a few big hands, and you're still going to bet the same way, right? It's still I'm playing the odds. It's pretty frothy right now, so we probably will be more cautious than some.

[Walter Piecyk, Partner and TMT Analyst at LightShed]

Okay. Thank you.

[Operator]

Your next question comes from Michael Rollins with Citi. Please go ahead with your question.

[Michael Rollins, Managing Director at Citi]

Thanks, good afternoon. Just curious, Charlie, if I could ask a follow-up to that, then a second question. The follow-up, when you discuss being more cautious than some, does that also apply to the value of EchoStar, or is that specifically relating to other investments or new investment opportunities? Secondly, if you're able to clarify, did I read correctly that you're still waiting on a waiver from the FCC with respect to holding on your spectrum without a network? Is there any outstanding risk that the FCC could take back remaining licenses that you still control and own, that may preclude you from monetizing the spectrum you discussed earlier, the AWS-3, the CBRS, the 700 MHz? Thanks.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

I'll take the first part, then Jeff will take the second part. We're cautious about everything, that includes EchoStar. We're just cautious on the marketplace in terms of a lot of our value is based on SpaceX. We're just cautious on the--we're not pessimistic, we're just cautious because things are at historical highs in almost every metric, that's all. That may be stupid, that may be smart, we don't know.

[Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary at EchoStar]

In terms of spectrum, in September, as you know, the FCC, from the chairman, confirmed that we had met our build-outs, we had met our commitments. That is sort of the last official statement from the FCC. As you mentioned, we have filed a waiver for our remaining spectrum licenses to sell those for fair value, in exchange for an extension of building out the network. We're awaiting that. It makes sense now that we don't have a network any longer for that to be granted. We hope the FCC will rule on that in the near term.

[Michael Rollins, Managing Director at Citi]

Thank you.

[Operator]

Your next question comes from Bryan Kraft with Deutsche Bank. Please state your question.

[Bryan Kraft, Lead Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank]

Hi, thank you. I have a few, if I could, mostly follow-ups. I guess first, just going back to the buybacks, will you be seeking an amendment to the covenant that's restricting the share repurchases? Also related to that, would you consider buying back the converts in the open market, which I don't believe would need an authorization? On the investing side, I was just wondering if you could elaborate on the change in strategic direction that was alluded to in the 8-K announcing Hamid's resignation, and what that really meant. Just going to the topic of DBS consolidation, which obviously there's a carve-out for in the covenants in the pre-pack. One of the worries that investors have is that DISH could end up being the buyer in that scenario. I know the last time, obviously, DirecTV was the buyer.

[Bryan Kraft, Lead Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank]

Just curious how you're thinking about, at this point, if there were going to be a combination, I know that's not a guarantee. Is it more likely that it would be similar to the September 2024 merger agreement where DirecTV was the buyer, or would you be open to being the buyer? Just the last one, I just wanted to sort of do a reality check with you on just maybe what the risk is on the timeline for the DISH Wireless and DISH DBS bankruptcies, just given the opposition from the infrastructure companies. Thank you.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Yeah. I'll take that last one, the timeline of DISH Wireless first. I think our confirmation hearing is set for October 13th. I think our expectation today is that the DISH Wireless bankruptcy could be wrapped up in the fourth quarter of this year. Now to go back to your first question, buybacks. We do have some restrictions on buyback. To the extent we ever wanted to buy something back, we'd look at whether that was even possible and if it wasn't, what we would do. We look at everything, right? The converts, it's my understanding that we don't have any restrictions on buying converts, but whether that would make sense for us is a whole other question. Change in investing, Hamid had done a lot of work on that side.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Again, a lot of things that he put in place, he's kind of handed off to Tom, and I don't see a change in that strategy. Other than because we're all out of one place now and we're all kind of daily conversations, so just communication's a little bit better. I think we look at our core businesses first a little, and Tom is heavily involved in that. He had additional things going on that Hamid didn't have going on. Now that's all combined, and so the priorities are still pretty much the same. Look at our business, look at other opportunities, and if we can't find anything, use our capital, whether it be stock buybacks or dividends.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Good management's going to find opportunity. Because things are frothy, I think opportunities are a little bit harder because there's a lot of cash on the sidelines and some pretty interesting valuations out there.

[Bryan Kraft, Lead Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank]

Am I hearing you correctly?[crosstalk].

[Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary at EchoStar]

DirecTV question.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Oh, DirecTV.

[Bryan Kraft, Lead Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank]

Oh, sorry. Yeah, go ahead.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

I've always said it's inevitable to put the companies together. We've probably squandered some opportunity to do that because obviously there's still synergies there, but they're obviously not as high as they would've been before. I think we would look at it. We have no preconceived notions. If there was a willingness on DirecTV's part to do something with the companies and what that might look like, buyer, seller, joint, we have no preconceived notions of that. The question would be, is there something at the right value? We think we're playing a little bit longer-term game at DISH. We are investing in that business. We're investing in how we approach the customer and the customer relationships.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

In the short term, that's kind of a negative to OIBDA or EBITDA. You could have a shorter-term approach and make those numbers go up and we have to look at it from a holistic perspective and say, we know the business well, we know the industry well, and I think we have pretty good ideas of valuations. If there was something where people could agree on valuations or agree on incentives going forward, when I say invest in our businesses, that's one of those things where you would invest in it. If somebody made the right offer, it's not a critical component of what we have to have going forward. We like that business, so.

[Bryan Kraft, Lead Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank]

Just on the buyback, Charlie, it sounds like you don't have any real plan to buyback stock, and maybe you're even a little cautious on the valuation of EchoStar because of the valuation of SpaceX, even though your stock is trading at a 50% discount to NAV and you're increasing the authorization to $5 billion. We're all kind of struggling to understand what the real message is here and why you increased the authorization while you sound like you don't really have any plans to buyback stock. Is there something that we're missing here, or can you maybe shed a little more light on that?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Yes, you're missing the fact that, A, good management gets themselves in position to have flexibility. Obviously, the larger buyback doesn't require us to buy anything back. Should the marketplace be displaced or we see an opportunity because we don't have other opportunities, then we're positioned to do something if we want to. Also missing that, I know you got to write reports and you got to analyze things. Again, this is a company that's got a 46-year track record of managing capital and running a relatively successful business, despite massive changes sometimes in our future over those 46 years.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

I don't think we fit into the normal box of professional management, multiple of EBITDA, come to conferences and talk about how great you're going to do and get to the end of the quarter and do unhealthy long-term things to make a particular number. We think about it long term. We think about growing value for our shareholders long term, and we try to make the best decisions. We're making decisions that an owner would make. Right. An owner that believes in building long-term value, and it doesn't fit into the normal box of what you might do.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

As a result of that, I'm not trying to be evasive. We don't know what we'll do with our capital other than we believe that with our capital, we'll be prudent. We probably have some mix of risk in terms of some things we take a relative risk on, and some places we're conservative. We're generally conservative as a company, right. It's rare that we take a big risk. We've had to do it a few times. Most of the time, it's turned out successful, but we're generally a conservative company.

[Bryan Kraft, Lead Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank]

I certainly appreciate that. Thank you for the answer. I do think there's a big opportunity to create long-term value, though, because of that NAV discount. That was more the nature of the question. Thank you.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Yeah. I think it's Captain Obvious.

[Operator]

Thank you. A reminder to the audience, if you'd like to ask a question, press star one on your phone. To remove yourself from the queue, press star two. Your next question comes from Mark Dunbar with JPMorgan. Please state your question.

[Mark Dunbar, Research Analyst at JPMorgan]

Hey, Charlie. Appreciate taking the question. Just given all the various lawsuits and machinations over the past year, just wondering how you think about access to the capital markets going forward. Obviously, you have a lot of cash. I would like to just get your thoughts on that.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

I don't think we need access to the capital markets today, we're not really thinking about that. I do think it's important to try to work with our bondholders to get to a good solution. I include vendors in that. The tower companies did a good job for us. On the other hand, they made a lot of money on us, and they're going to lease out their capacity to others. The way I look at it, to do things professionally and realistically and unemotionally, that's what we'll try to do. I've said this many times, that it's unfortunate that particularly the tower companies instituted litigation because it stopped the communication.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

I have lawyers on both sides. Lawyers make money by litigating. They have no incentive to try to get clients together, and you end up going through attorneys, and it takes a while. It takes much longer to get to the right answers, which normally ordinary people who are realistic and want to get to a solution that's better than not having a solution, it just takes longer time. It's unfortunate that the litigation happened, I knew as soon as that started getting litigated, that that was going to lead to a much longer procedure.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

Now we have a third party, which is a judge in bankruptcy, the third party's going to make decisions for us, which one side or the other may like or not like. My experience has been I'd rather make that decision myself in negotiation, it takes two to tango.

[Mark Dunbar, Research Analyst at JPMorgan]

Okay. Makes sense. Thanks.

[Operator]

Your next question comes from Michael Abatemarco with Helix Partners. Please state your question.

[Michael Abatemarco, Analyst at Helix Partners]

Hey, Charlie. Thanks for taking the call and the questions. I just was wondering if you'd be able to clarify the $5 billion-$7 billion liability as relates to the SpaceX taxes. Does that also include the kind of appreciation in value in SpaceX, and does that include any kind of 1033 dynamics?

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

The answer is, it's taken all those variables into account, against our best guess. It could be a little higher or a little lower. It's just we're trying to give you some indication of where it might be. If you take the high end of that, take $7 billion and said, "Here's where we think it's going to be," you probably got a model that's realistic for what we know today. We're trying to give you some guidance, we don't normally give guidance, I guess don't even take this guidance as guidance. It's our best guess. What makes it difficult is there are a lot of variables, because there could be 1033s, there could be other things that affect.

[Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board at EchoStar]

We have litigation that's going to affect the shutdown cost of the network. Obviously, it could be higher, given where the tower companies think things should go. As of today, and we'll let you know if things change, but as of today, we still see things in that range. It's up to us as management. It's going to take some work to get it to that range. We're certainly not there yet.

[Operator]

All right. Thank you very much. Have a good day.

Participants

Executives

• Charles Ergen, Co-Founder and Chairman of the Board

Analysts

• Jeff Blum, Acting Chief Legal Officer and Secretary at EchoStar
• David Barden, Partner at New Street Research
• Brent Penter, Equity Research Analyst at Raymond James
• Sebastiano Petti, Senior Research Analyst at JPMorgan
• Walter Piecyk, Partner and TMT Analyst at LightShed
• Michael Rollins, Managing Director at Citi
• Bryan Kraft, Lead Equity Research Analyst at Deutsche Bank
• Mark Dunbar, Research Analyst at JPMorgan
• Michael Abatemarco, Analyst at Helix Partners